Hmmm this should be an interesting discussing to read as all are really good questions…
I always enjoy your post and lore insight Baal.
It makes me wonder… hmmm do Elves have their own Gods in general or since they come from Trolls they are tied to those too? Hmmm or even other races in general…
I guess with SL and Legion reveals Blizz has open the gates to the Cosmic and Divine Realms of WoW…
Haha I feel like my WoW character is about to start their high level Epic adventure you do in D&D were you start to explore these Extra Planar realms… but better cuz we are in WOW! No more tiny mortal adventure for this WoW character!
Night Elves have pretty much left behind the traditional Troll loa to worship Elune, exclusively. At one point, both were worshipped, but it’s unclear if this is early in their history as Night Elves, or late in their history as Dark Trolls (the presence of the Lun’alai makes me think the latter, though). https://wow.gamepedia.com/Crumbling_Ceremonial_Vestments
Though, interestingly, Druids have gone back on this, and are basically running a polytheistic mystery cult of their own Night Elven Wild Gods on the side. Elune is still paramount to them, but they worship the Wild Gods, too, as seen by all the shrines all over Hyjal, various idols (Idol of Remulos, Idol of the Wilds), and different sects centered around some of these idols (the Druids of the Talon and the Idol of Aviana).
Also of interest is, in one of the War of the Ancients novels (iirc), Elune is depicted in a ceiling mural helping create Azeroth alongside a pantheon of other gods. Some speculated they were the Titans. I supppose, now, some could theorize that they could be retconned to be the First Ones. Or… it could just be old, out of date lore.
That is not quite true, Ardenwaeld, or rather the heart of the forest was only of CENTRAL importance for his imprisonment. Even the kyrians can´t do their work without the magic of ardenwaeld to traveler in and out of the shadowlands.
Ardenwaeld was beside oribos most likely the oldest creation in the entire shadowland. The First one used the table in oribos to create the dimension Shadowland and build their City there, but its written their do all their “Creationworlk” from that table.
No, because Oribos was associated with the creation of the entire plane. They created this plane: Shadowland, and then created Oribos from where they continued working on the Shadowland. The Ethernal ones are probably from them, too. Ardenwaeld is somehow in the “Centerplace” beside Oribos, in the function of the shadowlands right now.
The lead Designer of entire WOW hinted to us, what the first one are, they are the true creator gods and even oribos nsc´s say to you, if the jailer come free, all WHAT the first ones did will be gone.
I’m saying at the Dawn Of Life And Death, the Shadowlands had one way of working. Neither the Archon nor Arbiter nor Denathrius etc was around.
Then something happened that led to a coup, and the First Ones changed stuff up, thus reshaping the Shadowlands as we know it today.
Doesn’t mean the Shadowlands as a plane was created by the First Ones, just that the realms of the Shadowlands now were made by the First Ones. If you build a city over a forest, the forest still used to be there.
If the Jailer is now jailed it means he used to NOT be jailed and this was the normal lol
The current order in the shadowlands was built from the ethernal ones, not the first ones. The first ones created the Shadowlands, oribos and afterward the ethernal one and leave the Shadowlands in their Hand. The Maw was not allways the maw, he had another function, and even his plane was not a prison without a route of escape.
The first ones generally create things, then they create servants, titan-like beings with enormous power to manage their work. What is noticeable is that these “beings” always follow certain purposes.
“but I will say that they are tied into the other Pantheons we have seen before like the Titans”
Oribos was built by the First Ones, we have no confirmation that all the Shadowlands as a plane of existence was created by the First Ones. If anything the opposite. It means Oribos wasn’t there before the First Ones intervened. And Kyrians weren’t made without a vessel from Ardenweald. And Ardenweald’s heart is tied to the lock on the Maw.
All of this in summation implies that before the Jailer got jailed, there was a prior order to the Shadowlands, and that the First Ones had a hand in getting the Jailer jailed.
And yes, the First Ones, as i’ve stated multiple times in multiple threads, I agree are definitely the “Creator Group” of WoW, like if Tolkien Eru were multiple beings like the Valar.
This is speculation Zahir. All we have confirmed as far as timeline goes is:
Oribos was built by the First Ones
The Jailer was jailed by the Eternals at some point; meaning the Jailer was not always jailed and that was the previous Normal
The Maw’s lock is tied to the Heart of the Forest of Ardenweald
Ardenweald was created by the Winter Queen’s hand; if she dies it dies, if it dies she dies.
The Winter Queen says all the Eternals together helped jail the Jailer.
Kyrian Crest of Ascension to make winged Kyrians (Psychopomps) was made with a Vessel from Ardenweald; this means that Kyrians could reproduce only AFTER Ardenweald was made
The Kyrians are the ones who have “always” been the psychopomps, bringing all souls to Oribos and the Arbiter
but the Kyrians couldn’t ascend without a Vessel from Ardenweald existing, which means Ardenweald predates the Kyrians
but Ardenweald was made by the Winter Queen
and Ardenweald’s heart was used to seal away the Jailer
and Oribos was built by the First Ones
and one of the peoples in Oribos called the “Observers” were tasked by the Arbiter to watch the Maw vortex thing as their “Purpose”
What is the logical conclusion timelinewise? Do you think a preview webpage is being literal, or is it merely colorful language and there’s a deeper plot?
Except all the Medallions of Sin were made from Denathrius’ power, and Prince Renathal was the first Venthyr ever made and given the Medallion of Dominion, and when Denathrius empowers you with the Medallion of Dominion during the leveling questline to help you bring in the Accuser for punishment, the anima produced isn’t the Red Venthyr Anima but the Black Maw Anima.
I do not believe that the First Ones made the Eternals, nor that the Jailer is an Eternal. Afterall, the Collector’s Edition box art has SIX circles on the back and on the cover of the art book, four of which we know are associated to the four covenants, one of which is the symbol of the snake used in Oribos where the Arbiter is, and the last one is 100% the mask/head/face of the Runecarver.
The Jailer does not have a “symbol” thus far; unless he is the Shadowlands in the same way the Winter Queen and Ardenweald are tied.
IMHO the timeline is:
Shadowlands and Jailer come into being from Death existing
One singular ever-expanding continent for the dead, rather than infinite realms, where the Jailer is the Jailer of the Dead, i.e. no souls return to reality, and is judge and jury of the Shadowlands.
Makes the Runecarver from a soul
Makes the Primus from another soul
Makes Denathrius from another soul
Make the Archon from a mortal soul
Possibility A of Arbiter being made
Kidnaps the Winter Queen, who is tied to the First Ones, and like Persephone was happy, until unlike Perspehone she wasn’t
First Ones get involved, make Oribos, help Jail the jailer, and “Sunder” the Shadowland (singular) into Shadowlands (plural)
Possibility B of Arbiter being made using the “heart” of the Jailer (that floaty black orb thing that’s very suspiciously parallel the Jailer’s heart)
Existence continues with this new order.
This is why the Jailer cannot be destroyed but only imprisoned. If he dies or is destroyed, the Shadowlands ceases to exist. He is Death, the same way Erebus is both a realm and a being.
lol
They really should teach mythology and the 101 of various religions in public and private education; everyone should know the basics of most popular religions and myths. Would help with a basic comprehension of other world regions.
And? The war between the Ethernal ones was not before the First ones vanished, but thereafter.
My timeline does not cause conflict, chronologically. Your enumeration of Revendreth just didn’t change anything about the timeline and btw: the jailer is an Ethernal one.
