I think a big problem may be that this whole departure happened when you reacted to me reacting to Archmage. Who I still feel was pushing the idea that not discussing new additions was toxic, as a way to turn the conversation into something friendlier to their wants.
I prefer stronger identities for the playable choices, so there’s a degree of wanting the options to tie in to that identity, which means I think some things should be off the table, and some of the suggestions could use some tweaking. Like that numbered chart I think Sara came up with, I think 1 should be cut, maybe an option between 2 and 3, and then another few intermediate steps between the 3(if I remember right that’s current Velf) and 4 (which was EE on all the time)
This is why people have no sympathy for Pro HE requesters who literally are receiving a lot, and go around forming their next list of asks with an sad pessimistic tone a lot of times, and framing the ask like VEs aren’t already getting a lot.
But why is “exclusivity” a desirable thing? I seriously do not get it. I can talk about what I would want VE’s to have, what I would want BE’s to have that makes sense for them, but I don’t get the idea that because “some” options could be shared/overlap, then it’s RUIN!!!
Why does someone else getting something closer to what you have botter you dear lord
Time is limited Hyper.
The notion is “what gives me the most bang for my buck with the least amount of work?”
This is just sealioning at this point.
Someone says “why does exclusivity matter?”
Someone answers, you go “well you didn’t explain it”.
They explain again, you ask the same thing, over and over and over.
Like…come on now.
At some point, you’re willfully just ignoring what you’ve been told.
I went through this with you before, you simply dont want to understand, not because it has not been explained to you before.
Ideally Blizzard would be more communicative with their intentions. If they truly intend for Void Elves to encompass the Alliance High Elf request, then it would help if they stated such. Granted, Blizzard did say they were adding more customization so we can make our characters the way we want them to be, such that we can make a Wildhammer Dwarf out of a Dwarf.
If that same intent also applies to Void Elves (and I think it’s fair to assume it does), then would that not mean that Blizzard wants us to be able to make our High Elf characters out of Void Elves? Again, it shouldn’t require a specific Blizzard comment to state that, but for this particular race it seems necessary.
The entire Shadowlands customization overhaul runs contrary to the notion of a single identity for each race and I personally don’t think it’s fair for any race to get pigeonholed into a single identity when everyone else is being given relative carte blanche to be what they want to be.
I seriously do not get this desire to have a copy of something that is already playable. Someone else got something that you’d like a slightly different version of, why go on a years long quest to get something that’s already playable? Oh no! Something you like isn’t quite perfect, it needs to be copied over and made the way I want it!
That’s just how I see it. It’s not the right way to see thing. Just me pointing out that some people really don’t get what the big deal is about your side of the coin.
And really, I wonder the same thing as your last sentence. Why does it bother you so much that the high elves ended up on the horde in TBC?
Why does sharing assets remove the desire for Void Themes?
I’m literally a person that wants more HE assets swaps AND more Void Themes. Whose desire is removed?
Because, as a developer, you should be aware that a part of your audience actually likes the Void Themes? Obviously??
That’s why we NEED more people hyping VE customization options, in case it has been missed, to show interest instead of whining because other want more HE swaps.
I love how you cut out the part where I say
It’s just so frustratingly disingenuous to say “oh I got less options so it’s worse” and to pretend that you loose if don’t get as many options, instead of looking at the quality of those options.
Don’t you hear yourself? You are more worried that numerically you get less options rather than how the options YOU HAVE satisfy you, how messed up is that? Not be able to enjoy what you actually get even if it’s top notch because someone else just got more?
Uniqueness is one of the most attracting traits for somebody picking and playing a race. It is not the only one of course, background lore, racial abilities also are a factor, but the aesthetic factor is the one that stands out and in your face for the majority of the gameplay experience.
For me personally, if Orcs were on both Horde and Alliance, I probably wouldn’t have even played this game to begin with (after having loved the race in Warcraft 3). People can feel and have a sense of pride in their faction race, rivalry towards the other faction, and being aesthetically unique is a huge part of that.
Of course you may see this differently, but you’re not in the group that’s losing such exclusivity, so you have a different perspective of it, and that is okay.
I just don’t remeber you ever giving a good argument for exclusivity, instead say “Oh I already explained that” without attempting to address it further.
I keep asking someone to make an argument for exclusivity being a good thing, and for some that seems to mean I can’t disagree with that.
Is that just no one has given me a good reason, least you of anyone.
so far, we arent getting necklaces, crowns, circlets, bracelets, body jewelry, blonde, red, brown, white or black hair. nor are we getting blue, pink, green, purple hair, nor two toned hair, etc. so far, we’re just getting skin colors that belfs, humans, dwarves and gnomes, already have. we dont have the unique death knight hair colors that every core race has - our dks have our normal hair colors, a grand total of 6 unique hair colors - the same ones. and we cant be demon hunters, so we dont have that either. i dont begrudge you what you have but to suggest i’ m being greedy for just wanting a decent looking thalassian elf on alliance is not fair and it’s starting to bug me.
Finishes being called a bundle of sticks in a raid he was leading during pride month no less.
Hey like, can we not use the term gatekeeping to refer to someone who thinks your ideas for a video game are bad?
Gatekeeping example.
I’m FtM, a little over five years ago I found that I could not get cancer screenings because of dysphoria. So I asked for a hysterectomy from my primary care physician and they sent me to an OBGYN.
The OBGYN proceeded to play breeder bingo with me. She asked me why I don’t want kids, tried to convince me to have kids, suggested an egg donor. She asked if I had my boyfriend’s permission and when I told her that he didn’t have a d (I was dating another trans man) she suggested I get a male donor.
This was the start of a five-year journey before I finally got a hysterectomy and the only reason I successfully got one is because I turned out to have severe endometriosis.
See this is my issue with the argument. You point out to it as if it is a self evident truth.
To me, it simply is not. I don’t choose characters based on whether anyone else can make them or not. I literally can’t fathom why it matters.
Indeed, as someone that plays both factions, the idea of exclusivity just doesn’t mean anything to me, and the issue is that I have yet to get a good explanation. Not one that convinces me, but one that makes me see the value of it.
At best I agree that each group should have a thing exclusive to them, but my threshold of overlap is just larger.
I’m not asking for all the BE hair colors and styles, might as well get kultiran ones, IDK. Cause my issue is about the “HE fantasy”.
Look…I am not going in a circle with you on this subject again just because you’re too obstinate to acknowledge the value of it. At this point, you’re just barking the same question over and over again. Not interested. Either acknowledge the points given to you or simply admit you don’t care about it.
Because development time is limied. You now have a void elf theme, and a high elf theme. I don’t need to go deeper into either one since its fulfilled. Everything else is jewelry and cosmetic fluff.
Why would I care about giving more time to void elves when again, you have a void elf theme and now a high elf theme.
My time is limited, and my time is money.
Now I can spend time making new assets such as jewlery and tattoos that don’t need to delve into a theme thats been established in a few skins and hair styles.
Boom, job done.
Showing interest means nothing the moment the HE assets got shared.
Wrong, this is a strawman, and if not a strawman, a display that you really haven’t gotten it after 30+ posts of an explanation.
It is a matter of variety.
People will take 3 options of red, blue, and yellow, than take 10 options of blue.
Void elves have red and blue.
High elves just have red.
I’ve said this several times, especially to you.
At this point, I am unsure if maybe its just a case of you being so stuck in your position that you fail to read what I have placed in front of you, but if you cannot understand this in such simplistic terms then it is a waste to hold any form of discussion with you.
That seems to be an issue with you quite a lot. Sorry, I am not interested in explaining the same tired explanation for 4k posts dude. If you need to keep asking the same question despite the same answer, the issue is you.
Wrong, its that you won’t accept the reason, not because there is a lack of validity. Its like someone explaining the reason the sky takes on the colors it does, and you going “That is not a valid explanation, explain it to me differently.”
Like…dude…seriously?
You’re just wasting everyone’s time.
Honestly, the only thing I want is for Blood Elves to have (non tentacle) void elf hair styles, and some night elf ones too. In exchange, hair styles can be swapped. Hair styles of all things being shared doesn’t sound too outrageous. I’d love face piercings and chokers for blood elves too, which is what night elves are getting. If Void Elves are getting High Elf customization and looking like Blood Elves as opposed to being dark and voidy? That’s fine. Let me, in that case, at least play a goth/punk Blood Elf without being yelled at for trying to steal those themes.
I mean, I’m a Blood Elf DK for gods’ sakes. That’s goth as it is, getting options to reflect this would be nice as opposed to having all blood elves be painted as just ‘lol prissy princesses’. Now void elves can be either dark/edgy or lighter/high elves. Equal exchange is all I’d really like.
Edit: In case someone asks ‘but what about night elves getting xyz from blood elves’? Yes. I entirely agree with that too. Give night elves blood elf stuff if they give blood elf night elf hair styles (So much elf in my sentence). The more options for both sides, the merrier, especially when it comes to jewelry and hair. Oh and any other race for that matter <3
Um…how do you know?
You want to know how I know you’re getting many of these options?
because the kul tirans are getting these options in the customization option lines, and they haven’t even been shown to have these options yet.
And kul tirans use a completely unique model.
So if they have all of those assets lined up for SL, its safe to say void elves have quite a bit of options coming there way as well
Because one is sustractive and the other is additive. You don’t loose options if someone else gets something similar, the other person gets more options, that’s it. Exclusivity is just about not wanting someone else to get something closer than what you have, and for what? So you can say “this is mine”?
… It literally does not bother me. I love that the Blood Elves are on the Horde.
Literally imagine the face of confusion I have right now at you saying that nonsense.
yeah but kts are humans. anything they give velfs is weighed against what belfs already have, because unlike kts and sw humans, sharing anymore options between velfs and belfs is apparently not good.
I can try to explain it. I don’t fully understand the why, but… it’s sorta related to how scarcity affects value.
When something is scarce, or in this case exclusive, it psychologically enhances the value. The scarce/exclusive thing becomes precious and a feather in one’s cap as it were. It’s like those mounts with low drop rates or that were removed from the game being valued higher solely due to their rarity/exclusivity rather than for their aesthetic appeal.
For example, I have the Plagued Proto-drake mount, which I believe is only obtainable now via the BMAH, and the title “The Undying” which I believe is unobtainable now. To many players having those things is pretigious due to their rarity/exclusivity. To me I just like the looks of the mount and the title sounds cool. I place no more value to them than I do the sparkle pony mount from the cash shop or the Loremaster title, but for some reason that I don’t fully understand, many people value things more when not everyone can have them.