The Sunfury where Kael’thas Elves.
And none of those Sunfury are felblood elves.
The felblood elves remained loyal to kaelthas, hence their ability to glut themselves on fel energy until they transformed.
The sunfury who turned away from kael’thas arent warped.
Why do aesthetics only matter if they are “exclusive”? That’s the problem with your premise, pretending thematics and aesthetics don’t interact uniquely with a specific race. They are still different aesthetics choices for the same race; to try to say “this is better because they are the only ones that can be this” falls in the nonsense of because something is exclusive, is better.
7 Likes
Aesthetics matter when they are exclusive because that exclusivity is what breeds difference both for that “race” and the faction to which they belong.
Saying blood elves have a unique theme in demon hunter doesnt work when the demon hunter theme is also shared with night elves.
Saying blood elves have a unique theme for DK’s doesnt work when everyone rock the undead theme through them.
That would be like saying “well maghar orc don’thave their brown skin theme because NPC orcs are brown like Garrosh.”.
Exclusive is indeed better even if you don’t agree with it. It is what says to the player “I am different for this.”.
It is the difference between a Breton, and a Nord, and redguard.
All three are human, but all three provide a unique aesthetic even though they offer the same classes entirely.
2 Likes
I’m so hyped for Shadowlands pre-patch, I can’t wait to finally be able to play one elf that looks alive. We finally broke that damn blue skin curse!
Geez, hadn’t Blizzard added these customization options for Void Elves/Draenei/Nigh Elves, and later on, added Kyrians for Alliance, we would’ve ended with freakin four blueish races.
Playing Alliance would’ve felt like this song:
Cuz, you know, Alliance already uses blue a lot in their clothing, armor, buildings, and other common assets…
I mean, I love blue, but not to this extent…
7 Likes
And that’s my core issue with this, I don’t think exclusivity is meaningful by itself. “only you can have a holy theme, only you can have a void theme” that’s nonsense to me; It’s far more interesting how each race interacts differently with a thematic, how their culture defines their approach to it, that’s what creates an actual cultural theme, the interaction, not the sole propiety of any them such as “void” or “fel”.
An orc mage is by no means the same than a Nightborne mage, just like a Zandalari Prelate is not the same than a Human Paladin. Their own cultures and ideologies interact uniquely with these themes, creating something indeed unique based on context.
“Only one can have a light theme” is utterly reductive and simply out, bad, IMO.
9 Likes
I do hope the Pre-Patch is longer this time around; will be fun to run around with new characters with the new level system.
10 Likes
Yes but again you can’t pretend they aren’t adding Wildhammer Dwarves and Sand Trolls-- and probably a host of similar new ‘sub-races’.
When you make a ‘Dwarf’ in this game it quite clearly rams it down your throat that you are in fact specifically a Bronzebeard.
It just seems Blizzard don’t care about that anymore, because what matters is player choice. It just isn’t such a serious and overall story breaking change to be concerned with.
What the old quests and story tells the player doesn’t matter so much now-- so why should the ‘flavour addition’ to your race? As in ‘Void’ or ‘Blood’. I think you’ll find a Sand Troll is just as different to a Darkspear Troll than a Void Elf to a Blood or High Elf.
2 Likes
The exclusivity is meaningful because this is a video game first, and a story second. When you boot up character creation, you don’t get ANY of their culture from what you see.
You see how they look, and what classes they can play and that is it.
So if night elves and blood elves can be Demon hunters, then its not an exclusive thing.
If everyone can be a DK, its not an exclusive thing.
It goes down to that big basic aspect which is their looks.
Is it reductive? Yes.
But it is the honest way things are looked at from a gameplay view, because that is how the player perceives it.
It is a matter of psychology, and the only people who look into lore are people who have already gone beyond character customization for sometime. The majority of people who play a game don’t think about the hardcore stuff or the lore stuff.
They hit accept to the quest, go to point A, complete it, and then move on.
1 Like
You say that as if the first experience is the final one.
People may begin completely ignorant of what the factions mean, and how the races fit into them.
However, that changes. I think you’ll find the vast majority of people switch what their main is after they learn the basics.
“Oh first I just picked Alliance because I like blue, but now I know Horde is my cup of tea.”
That doesn’t mean EVERYTHING has to be ‘exclusive’ in the way you mean it. Most things are, and again you simply cannot ignore the fact people want High Elves for GOOD REASONS-- which most certainly count. It isn’t wanting to ‘steal pretty pink elves’.
8 Likes
Nothing of this even address why exclusivity is a good thing.
Of course we at first glance base our choices on aesthetics. But why does it matter that no one else gets a similar aesthetic? Why “only I get this” should matter?
All you are saying here is aesthetics matter, not that exclusivity does. Which is irrelevant to learning more about the lore and learning how similar aesthetics lead to different thematics for each race.
But you are not explaining why exclusivity is a good thing at all.
8 Likes
It’s worse for him.
Exclusivity in his view is limited to within one faction. In reality ‘exclusivity’ can mean many thing-- for one the Thalassian Elf as a race is exclusive in itself.
It’s as if the final word on characters is ‘They should have exclusive aesthetics that are limited to one faction.’.
It’s as if the definition has been so narrowly defined, and at the expense of everything else. As if there is no reason or precedent for these elves being on Alliance. The fact that they have been as NPCs for over a decade, and indeed the fact that they have been as a playable race for over a year, seems small fish because if you make them pink then, oh, the usual DOOM!! is upon us.
Doomsaying is common in these forums, and people who rail against High Elf or options to make them pretty much a reality always seem to have a flavour of that ‘the end is nigh’.
Of course part of that is the tired ‘slippery slope’ suggestion, which can again be countered easily by the nature of these elves. It isn’t some random request asking for Orcs or Trolls.
9 Likes
Or we have different tastes than you and feel that your desires will have a detrimental effect on the things in which our tastes differ?
Alliance players may want more of their faction than a copy cat of a Horde race that doesn’t really bring anything new to their faction and takes up space that could be used for something more unique that could bring what they consider a more interesting story to their faction.
Horde players might feel short changed that the game is placating the whining of people who have had the option to play the story of the race they want as they exist in the game, but refuse because they have been upset that they weren’t on the right faction. And now the characters they have may end up being the lesser version of the model, and with the way the writing has gone there’s a real fear that the story will now elevate the new at the cost of the existing race.
And in other tastes, some people think the best RPGs are the ones with practically no given story, just a sandbox where you can make what you want and with the right outfit or appearance can take any role you want. Others like a more curated experience with a finely crafted story that has a plot (or plots) that you move through and can put your stamp on, where while there is freedom of choices in the story, there may be more restrictions on your character but there’s more importance placed (and hopefully reflected in the story) of the choices you do get.
4 Likes
You do realize aesthetics and exclusivity go hand in hand in a game where visuals are limited yes?
you’re attempting to separate the two, when they really are not separate. It is in a sense, attempting to change the argument I am presenting to you.
I am stating that they are one and the same.
you are saying I am explaining only one in an attempt to make it easier to disregard and dismiss.
yes…like everything else is limited.
you dont have orcs, tauren, humans, or any other race swapping to the other side.
Blood elves and void elves were separated by color palette, not model, which made the differences literally skin deep.
now that the difference is gone, exclusivity is gone, and there is no reason to roll a blood elf.
The monster faction goes back to being the monster faction because hey, their pretty race? You can find that on the alliance so there is no reason to go there anymore.
There isnothing unique or interesting you get from a blood elf you cant get from another race or from the new void elf options.
That’s no bueno.
Ultimately, you and Talendrion say “well this doesnt matter to me, it shouldn’t matter to you.” which isn’t correct.
particularly given every other MMO, doesn’t do this, not even with skins,
2 Likes
I wouldn’t exactly say it is worse.
The problem with some people is that they think Faction Identity is still important, as if to say it is still 2004. Honestly, I wish they would just let it go, because it is clear on what Blizzard is doing and why they are doing it. After all, the game has to move forward, not sit in the same timeline that it was as if it was 2004?
Well the enormous aeroplane of my point has clearly flown 40,000 feet above your head.
I give up because you consistently fail to comprehend the points being made. It’s not a question of disagreement with you, it’s a matter of you being unable to respond to the arguments.
3 Likes
Well no because how is faction identity being compromised? It isn’t.
The reason is because these elves aren’t at all comparable to other races, with the exception of Pandaren.
It’s hilarious that Aguni unironically states “…and there is no reason to roll a Blood Elf…” If a player wants to be Horde, and wants to be a pretty elf, well they only have one choice.
It is absurd that people think it diminishes their personal experience because people on the other faction are running around looking the same-- merely LOOKING the same. It’s also hilarious that people think having pink elves on Alliance is somehow ‘theft’ similar to having Orcs make the transition.
5 Likes
No they are not meh for behaving.
But they don’t have much story left for them to be valuable as a race.
There are already low numbers of them and now even lower considering they are joining the ranks of void, also likely now that the war is over many would return back to silvermoon to the places they once lived in.
So while I appreciate they have a short history of being their own people they don’t really have much of a future.
Well, I don’t look at Faction Identity being compromise, because to me, the Faction Identity is “Horde vs Alliance”, not the races within. But it is not how Broflake looks at it. He thinks that Blizzard giving these options to Void Elves is destorying that faction identity, which it isn’t.
1 Like
Waiting for horde to get night elf options or human options to forsaken/nightborne.