Meh a lot of classes have something OP. Warrior is forever busted in raid, mage straight up breaks the game in dungeons/world farm, and now Druid wins almost all pvp. Nice happy balance.
1 Like
FACTS! Itâs even worse when theyâre in groups. We had five no-talent Druids prowling outside of Redridge just appearing and insta killing us all with starsurge and sun/moonfire. Itâs laughably unskilled gameplay for low rent, wannabe PvPers. I wound up having a 2min rez timer because of those morons.
What Blizzard needs to do is make player attacks cause percentage based damage to other players. Meaning that the spells and abilities would have a completely different effect and balancing on players than they would the various AI monsters around the world. This way, you wouldnât get a conflict between PvE and PvP balancing. The very thing that causes stupid crap like this to happen.
Youâre a troll, and not a very bright one at that. Youâre arguing in bad faith and muddying the waters with your weird personal jabs mixed with outdated information.
Arcane surge critting for 1500 dmg requires 10 seconds of casting arcane blast + mana recouping abilities, plenty of chances to counter play vs the mage in that scenario(have a pulse and you win vs the mage, for starters).
Starsurge in gear hitting for 240 is a laughable joke, it scales incredibly well and does 198 on the top end alone, your druid can get over or close to 100SP without worldbuff.
I am not a mage in real life, and you addressing me as âmageâ as if the truth about the game changes depending on the avatar I show is what I was getting at, it went over your head because I was aiming too high with that 85 IQ comment, shoulda aimed more like 70 IQ. Lesson learned.
Sure I understand, the problem with liars like you is you didnât come up with starsurge and if asked you would have suggested something completely different. But now that it is here and itâs broken in PVP you rally around it like this was the only obvious answer to helping balance druids in PVE encounters. There are 1000âs of ways to improve their PVE performance without making them the new hunter pets in pvp.
You better keep that same energy when mages and living bomb dictate who wins alterac valley and the new world pvp zones. (youâll contradict yourself and be a hypocrite about it)
That wonât work, you get starsurged, you conc shot, the druid shifts it and continues to maintain a range with HOTS that you canât threaten. Why do you continue to portray the druid as a complete moron but the hunter is a rank 1 pvp gladiator? All you have to do is shift and walk in the opposite direction of the hunter and you arenât going to get caught.
I already posted why we are likely going to hit 200-250 spell power and showed math on why we are very likely to see starsurge crits for 900-1200 dmg, and why it is extremely likely that this will be a substantial portion of peopleâs hp which will very likely cap out at 2300hp.
I showed my math in detail, I gave my reasoning in detail, you donât do any of that, you just troll.
Iâll respond to other posts you make to discredit your bad takes but I think Iâll ignore you directly because you are a waste of time with your bad faith appeals.
1 Like
It needs a massive nerf! Hunter treatment incoming!
1 Like
The no mana cost is the weirdest part tbh.
1 Like
the fact it doesnt really improve balance in pve is the strangest part imo
it needs more tie in to your rotation through buffs or debuffs. honestly druid in general is badly designed in sod. resto is overwhelmingly carried by wild growth and feral by mangle. balance is just a pure rune class in pvp too lol.
2 Likes
âNerf scissors.â -Rock
youre gonna be seeing that from all 3 mage specs, mind blast death from priests and many different things from ele sham. casters are going to be pretty out of control
wait til p3 when we get to experience lake of fire soul fire.
Noone said 1500 damage, just like people claiming Starsurge is killing people in a few hits. The requirement is the player dealing the damage needs to be incredibly geared, and the player receiving needs to be either undergeared, lower leveled, or simply geared for stam.
I have seen people do it, it requires no prep, it just requires a severe gear difference, exactly the same as Starsurge. At which point the player had no chance regardless of ability strength because gear plays a significant factor in performance.
Key word *average. The average between 162 and 198 is 180, the average between 222 and 258 is 240. It scales 1:1 with spell power, it doesnât take much to figure out.
âOver or close to 100SP without the worldbuffâ is the real, joke. Yes, your claim is exactly what I said before a full BiS druid.
You are complaining that a fully geared player with the best gear available is beating people without gear.
I used an actual reasonable amount of spell power, 60, for those calculations above, itâs easy to double check.
When max spell power is ~110 whilst having the staff which provides a substantial increase over the 1H/offhand combo below it having the assumption that people are 100SP without world buffs is frankly ridiculous and absurd.
Itâs deliberate manufactured bias to exaggerate the situation.
Yes âI have no valid argument so Iâm going strawman the argument, and if that doesnât work Iâll go with an ad hominem attack on the personâ
Iâll ask you again, can you on your little character blink? Can you Aspect of Cheetah? Can you Ghost Wolf? Can you use the W, A, S, D buttons?
I think youâre making it quite apparent what the actual issue is given your incessant deflection and inability to answer a simple question.
Lmao what?
I mean firstly again, more ad hominem.
But still, Starsurge or something else, the matter is runes needed to cover a lot a ground because of the poor state of balance coming into Sod.
Iâve said plenty of times that Blizzard should have actually done baseline.
Not at all, actually read any of my posts. Iâve advocated for scaling nerfs on Starsurge, with compensatory buffs on balanceâs hard casted abilities.
Which if you werenât so blinkered by your biases you would have been aware of.
The only thing I rally against is people extremely exaggerating or explicitly only referencing niche situations to exacerbate an issue, whilst denying the reality of the situation.
Balance druids in P1 canât chase, nor can they snare, so almost no classes should be left with âno counterplayâ from a class that has base movespeed. Either hard engage with the superior class, or disengage. Either way, you have options.
Letting someone cast one ability on you over 24-30s and complaining about counterplay is ridiculous, you let them do that to you in that scenario.
Better nerf it now then like Starsurge right? I donât see you advocating against it yet apparently you see it as an issue.
So who is really the hypocrite here?
You rally against one, but not the other. 
Shift and do what? Waddle away at base movespeed whilst you are now at range? God if you can trade a conc shot for 270 mana thatâs an amazing win. Regardless you are still in range of them now, and unless the druid is a so called R1 Gladiator they arenât getting that shift immediately, so you still have at least a globalâs worth of range youâve made up.
Also not sure how you canât threaten their HotS with one of the highest performing damage classes in the game. Rejuv really isnât that good 
Firstly even if it was moron vs R1, your argument was âno counterplayâ not âyou have to be skilled to counterplayâ.
Secondly, walking towards or away from someone is not some R1 skill
How are they not going to get caught when moving at base movespeed? Last I checked no class moves at lower than base movespeed and Hunter even has an ability to move faster.
Either the druid doesnât have Natureâs reach, or it doesnât have Feline Swiftness. So pick a lane, either the druid canât outrange you, or it canât outspeed you. It literally canât do both.
Lmao you say this yet deliberately in bad faith leave out where I said âuntil people get P2 raid gear from Gnomerganâ.
250 spell power with what items? Itâs factually correct that there is no where near that available outside of possible raid drops added with the new raid.
BFD gear is by and large going to be the best spell power gear until level 40 and the new raid, the staff off Kelris itself is stronger than the Staff of Jordan.
So as I said before, health will outscale spell power (which wonât increase much) until people start doing the Gnomer raid. Itâs pretty self evident by examining the actual facts.
2 Likes
i doubt sta will outscale damage when 39 twinks typically have 2.5k or below in vanilla.
they balanced bfd around people having under 1k hp, if they suddenly gave overbudget sta on new gear the raid itself will become a cake walk once everyone has a couple pieces and dont say thats the case for bfd because nearly everyone free action potted kelris which would have been quickly patched if they werent merciful.
on topic i dont think druids will be uniquely op in p2 and if you dare cheetah im tossing a flash bomb and cheesing you out of principle. i do think theyre horribly designed and would like to see that fixed so i can play mine again.
I was referencing explicitly before gnomer raid for spell power.
Currently the BFD spell gear is pretty much the best spell power you can get before the new raid release, as things like the staff beats out Staff of Jordan.
There just arenât enough substantial drops to change that in classic.
Being able to have 110 spell power at lvl 25 is a lot more threatening than having 130 spell power at 39 for example.
I absolutely agree once people are doing Gnomer that will change again and weâll be back to a similar situation scaling wise.
But prior to that, unless they release a lot of new quest and dungeon rewards, BFD spell power gear is going to still be some of the best in most situations, if not still the best.
1 Like
what makes you think gnomer wont have reitemized gear?
tbh though, having 110 sp at 40 is more threatening than at 25 because every caster is talent and skill rank reliant.
shaman for example will be casting a 3.0 coeff spell at 2s with 200% crit dmg. lava burst with no increase in sp will also gain crit dmg. dot classes are typically the ones that become frightening at 29 bracket but prayer of mending removes them as a threat completely. for pve logs paint the picture accurately of low level casters even with bis twink lvl sp.
i still dont understand why they settled on 25 and not 28 or 30, woulda been much better phase.
also i forgot frost mage are gonna be online in p2. thats pretty horrifying with fingers of frost and ice lance.
i white hit harder with crits on my war⌠450 ive seen way more then once 500plus on HS 480s on raging blow. more then once charge and 2 shot a fool
in premade vs pug, gl getting your enrage going in a real game.
I said until gnomer.
Of course Gnomer will have reitemised gear, just like BFD.
To clarify I said âuntil people are raid geared the scaling of spell power will reduce compared to increasing health pools, based off the current lack of decent spell power gear in that bracketâ
With Staff of Jordan, a level 35 epic staff being an example of one of the best spell power items for P2 bracket being outclassed significantly by the staff of Kelris.
So again, as I said, unless they change questing or dungeon drops (which they didnât in P1) BFD gear will continue to be some of the best until players start getting raid gear from the new Gnomer instance.
Iâd be interested to know which spell you mean, but coefficients donât change after level 20.
Rank 4 Wrath has a 0.571 coefficient, as does rank 8 at 54. Same with Starsurge, get it at level 3? 1.0 coefficient, level 40 1.0 coefficient.
I fail to see how 110 at 40 is scaling better than 110 at 25 for the same ability. If base damage of the ability goes up (which one can only assume it will) whilst the contribution from SP stays the same (since coefficient on abilities does change) then it is abundantly obvious that the spell damage coefficient will be contributing to a much smaller percentage of the overall damage.
If Starsurge is currently doing max 198 plus 110 from spell power at 25 (~36% damage from spell power), than lets assume it does 350 max plus 110 from spell power at 39, that is only contributing 24% towards the overall damage.
Meanwhile as casters have very limited spell power changes until Gnomer, stam from at least levels if not other classes like physical ones that will get more upgrades will increase by a greater degree.
1 Like
lightning bolt is 3s cast time and a talent reduces it by 1s retaining its coefficient but being much more spammable.
spell power wasnt the limiting factor for casters, its talents and spell ranks. if i recall even low sp maged were frost bolting for 500 in 40-49, a bracket with generally sub 3k hp as well.
on topic yes starsurge will not improve much until gnomer gear but if it does keep its full scaling it will be a problem
Any chance you can link me the LB coefficient, only spell IDâs I can see show 0.857 coefficient.
I agree, but that wasnât the argument people have been making.
The fact still remains that current spell power values wonât change much until 40 in comparison to stam.
Ranks and level scaling obviously occur separately to that comparison (again not saying itâs not relevant, simply it wasnât part of the conversation especially since largely we donât know the base level of scaling for runes yet)
Agreed. Which is what Iâve said from the start.
But apparently that is not what people have issue with regarding the spell, apparently the issue is âit existsâ and they want a range nerf, a mana nerf, a damage nerf, a scaling nerf, a cast time nerf, and a cooldown nerf before itâs âbalancedâ.
Whilst simultaneously ignoring the fact that the spec is severely underperforming outside of people who refuse to walk away from Starsurge in WPvP.
2 Likes
Correct, lightning bolt is kind of a trick in that it is a 2 second cast but scales like a 3 second cast, most spells only take off half a second from talents. A similar situation is true for chain lightning.
Frostbolt - 3/3.5*0.95 - 81.4%
Shadowbolt - 3/3.5 - 85.71%
Fireball Direct - 3.5/3.5 - 100%
Pyroblast Direct - 3.5/3.5 - 100%
Pyroblast Dot - 70% - 17.5% per tick (4) (exception to the rules)
Lightning Bolt - 3/3.5 - 85.71%
Chain Lightning - 2.5/3.5 - 71.42%
Running WSG tonight and it was a lot of druids who to their credit canât express skill because the kit has no skill expression, you just press 3 buttons and dunk people. It will be nerfed when people catch on and you see 3 druids in every WSG premade.
the point im making is even pregnomer the stamina we get from leveling will not keep up with the spike of damage weâll get from talents, spell ranks and new runes.
youtube . com/watch?v=nuCdfBa-LFo
Entertaining video, this kind of thing is going to go bye-bye or get outpaced by worse things, you can count on it, he even knows it in the title of the video. Have fun while you can, he isnât overly geared on his druid either, but he seems like a great player.