Nerf Breath of Sindragosa and buff 2h builds - Make DKS fun again

Classes Death Knight
1

The game is trying to force me to play dual wield and use BoS again, Frost was more fun when DW BoS wasn’t meta.

Seriously just rework DK already, it’s a mess.

With my ret pal and fury everything is 100x times easier to do, if i want to AoE i just AoE, with DK i have to make a whole set up before i can AoE, with Unholy i need plague on the adds, wounds and death and decay if i want do AoE, with Frost i need RW, DnD, Rime procs and KM procs to AoE, with Ret pal i just press Divine Storm and Wake of Ashes and BAM 300m DPS go brrrrrrrr very fun. With Fury i just press Odyns or Whirlwind and Rampage, BT etc go brrrrr 300m DPS and very fun

I just wanna have fun with DKs again, please nerf or rework BoS this is a cringe ability that no one likes, we only use it when it’s meta

I’ve never seen a fDK say “i love using BoS it feels so good” it’s always “i hate BoS but it does a lot of damage so it is what it is”

28 Likes
2

Haven’t read something this accurate on these forums in ages.

5 Likes
3

Yeah that’ll kinda happen when you play a spec designed around DW first.

People only use Breath when it’s meta? You mean like Obliteration? Unholy Assault? Shattered Destiny? People generally use the meta builds for their specs meaning that yes, the best performing talents will be picked.

And where’s your proof that no one likes Breath? There are more parses in normal Nerub for Frost than the entirety of what it had for normal & heroic S1-S3 Dragonflight raids combined and, based on the existing stats, it’s not even a top 5 DPS; it’s not even the FoTM melee and it’s pulling numbers almost equivalent to the FoTM melee specs and Frost was arguably stronger in 10.2 than now.

The fact is that most PvE Frost DKs either like or are indifferent to Breath and couldn’t care less about 2h. And the reason Breath is still on top is because Arctic Assault does too much without having any real cost to pathing to it.

1 Like
4

i love the current breath build. its really fun and satisfying since i can actually do something outside of breath windows.

5

I am a Breath enjoyer and to be perfectly honest you can pull very similar numbers with just DB or Rider obliteration. Breath just puts you slightly ahead and that’s only if you play it very, very optimally. Frankly I think I do better when I just play Oblit a lot of the time, but Breath is fun.

Play what you find fun.

2 Likes
6

I hate bos, I hate dw. But 2h is still very competitive atm. I think this mentality of something being bad just because it’s 1-3% behind something else isn’t healthy in game. It’s not just you, it’s such a common mindset in this parse focused era.

4 Likes
7

It doesn’t change the fact that devs double down on separate talents and tuning that favor one or the other as opposed to going down a path to make the spec more or completely weapon type agnostic.

Different weapon types and DW favorability atm makes it harder to flex into each spec and or different content. They need to pick one weapon type for frost going forward, less work on the development end and easier to balance.

8

i dont play breath. im playing dw oblit and its the most fun ive had with frost dk since legion.

9

You DK’s playing breath and loving it, you’re why the Lich King frowns on us. Bunch of toothpick wielding imbeciles. I’d be happy to strip you pathetic whelps of your death knight status and send you to the Saronite quarries for the rest of eternity till your bones become the pavement. You’re meant to swing a BIG SWORD, take the HARD HITS, SPREAD DEATH, icy or otherwise and be RELENTLESS. You all sound so pathetic. We are engines of death and destruction. Take your stick wielding builds and toss yourselves into the maelstrom.

4 Likes
10

Wow, the toxicity and misinformation in this thread is hilarious.

  1. The LK was primarily Unholy.
  2. Calling people imbeciles shows what is wrong with people and that they don’t have a single argument that is worth a damn.
  3. The rest of the information about what a DK is supposed to do is just people with headcanon that is based on a very narrow understanding of Death Knights. You do know that one of the first DKs was DW right? Along with some just using 1 1h?

This hate and bigotry bs needs to stop from you kids. It’s embarrassing.

11

First off, you ignominious, vacuous, imperceivably tiny brained, mollusk of an individual. I was being facetious if it wasn’t clear, because I was RP meme-ing, clearly. But you lack any conceptualization of nuance, or room reading, or the ability to discern sarcasm and play from actual criticism.

Secondly, if you’re referencing the Death Knights made in the Orc era, they’re death knights only in name and hardly by any true metric of what the class represented. Hush your baby rage. the first true Death Knight was raised during the third war and it was Arthas.

But even if you want to talk about the one true first generation Death Knight, that would be Teron Gorefiend and he used a glorified staff with a cudgel end like a 2 handed truncheon, not a one handed weapon.

You irritate with your mere imposition in this forum because you are a canker sore on the community getting inflamed at the slightest off step with your personal opinion and you rain down your bile on everyone else. Just stop. You are the definition of what needing to touch grass embodies.

Death Knights are cunning, highly skilled melee combatants with sub specialization in death magic. Their domains are blood, frost and unholy magic manipulation that is absolutely utilitarian in function and form.

They’re masters of undeath and martial prowess that use those magic schools to compliment their melee abilities. None of which were ever originally anything like 1 handed wielding weirdos we see now. Rune blades were always 2 handed weapons. Death Knights were always quick and imposingly strong. unholy speed and unholy might being a characteristic of their makeup.

Hell their genesis ideologically in the gaming space from DND (Dungeons and Dragons) made it clear that they weren’t push over, trifles of enemies to encounter.

In conclusion, shut it, stop making up stuff, there was nothing described as bigotry in what I said. You’re just a professional grifter and troll and you’re boring. I wish I could ignore you from my memory.

And no, the Lich King has many frost based spells in his tool kit. Unholy and Frost was his go to with a high use of straight up deathfrost magic. You’re wrong and you should feel bad.

16 Likes
12

my honest opinion on this is NOT to nerf BOS, just make the performance of the specs have parity. Then you just choose what you want out of the playstyle and PLAY IT, which was supposed to be the design philosophy from the beginning but because of the gaming brain rot e-sports has done to the game we don’t have that anymore.

The devs balance around that and goofy RACE to WORLD first gooners. And the PVE game enjoyment suffers, because like I said, they’re balancing the whole game around the tiniest subset of the player base instead of separating those place into their own arenas of function. Specs shoudln’t behave the same in a PVP environments as they do in a PVE environment. I’ve spent my career working in the live service game development, you have to separate these functions if you want your game to be good.

3 Likes
13

They do, pretty much. You can’t literally mirror numbers between the two because there are several multiplicative stats at play that change the fundemental equation behind damage calculation between weapon types.

Anybody who says they “cant” play a build is just getting in their own head about their performance.

3 Likes
14

My brother, they pretty much do not have parity, and part of the issue has a lot to do with the rolling Rube Goldberg machine that is our rotations. Every major dps step requires 3 different things to set it up. The mechanics are muddled with needless tedium. And that is a side point to what I meant by parity. Keep the stat weights the same for each spec.

Change their value based on what the spec needs, this cuts down on the ridiculous push of endlessly farming to get that one perfect piece of tank gear or DPS gear, for Death Knights and Demon Hunters specifically since their gear types are the same between specs, trinkets not withstanding of course. And it’s an relatively easy thing to address. Server checks the player’s environment, the sever checks the stat database, calls for the swap, the player stats weights and skill functions adjust for that change in real time.

They do it right now when players turn PVP on engage in pvp. Their skills change, the stat weights change in real time because they have PVP gear equipped. The system already exists.

Cut down on the prep steps needed to execute a dps cycle. My god, why do we have 2 abilities that need to on at the same time to pull off competitive numbers by any metric be on completely different cool down values? If them being on the same CD would equate to their consistent up-time be steam rolling, then tweak the overall bonuses by a small % to even things out. Even further why do we need a buff from another class to hit those peaks like the empowerment spell from Priests? That capability should be possible in the base kit.

This nonsense about having DPS abilities that need to synergize at the same time being on GCD is another balance axiom that doesn’t make sense for PVE content. They’re already in a very draconian sense, time-gating content.

So what if we kill the big bad better a little sooner? That’s what the higher difficulties are for. And if the issue is balancing against world first, well world first was a stupid e-sports type competition deal that shouldn’t have any bearing on the whole PVE ecosystem. If these e-sports versions of the game had no functional connection to the rest of the PVE ecosystem, the game design wouldn’t be so haphazardly managed.

If there’s bugs, fix the bugs, obviously. But this so-called tuning and re-tuning and deprecating and pruning is exhaustively bad hat. I remain unconvinced that the devs know what this class is supposed to be, and that follows with a few of them for sure.

2 Likes
15

Maybe DK just isn’t for you? Fun should come first, and almost every notable DK main is very fond of the retooling that happened this xpac…

1 Like
16

I’ve been main-ing DK since WOTLK with 2 exceptions, Legion and Dragon Flight, this is MY class. I’ve done my realm firsts on it, I’ve seen all the changes. Most DKs aren’t happy with these wishy washy changes. You see it in almost every thread. There are a lot of us on some weird brand of copium about the class and it shows. I’ve been playing long enough to know that my criticisms aren’t flippantly thrown together.

3 Likes
17

Agreed wholeheartedly.

18

You’re as feckless as Kelliste I see.

2 Likes
19

Nice logs, maybe get good at the class after 15 years before you have an opinion on it.

20

Ohhh… Yeah. Way to have a trip to the banned list with your literal hatred.

1 Like