If they enjoy weekly-no-leaving their +10 key every week, that’s not my problem. People can always lower the key if they want to. If they don’t time their +10, they’ll have a +9 next week anyway which can then drop back to +7.
TLDR of this thread is that players are unhappy if they can’t easily grind the max gear score. They don’t want a challenge, just the ability to open their character pane and feel good about the big number in the corner. Calling it “progression” is just a smokescreen for the reality that it’s all about the path of least resistance to number-go-up for the sake of number-go-up, not to use that power to achieve anything or actually progress.
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To what benefit is there for drastically increasing the rate of failure? And making pugging a miserable experience because now the people applying to keys, have to do religious vetting?
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I’m not sure I understand what you mean. Why would this drastically increase the rate of failure?
M+ should be punishing especially at the +10 range where the rewards are providing Myth track vault which is equivalent to Mythic Raiding. Key deplete for a reason and while I disagree with the change to the crest drops the depletion itself has an important purpose.
The affix having bad interactions is something that should have been hotfixed, but is still better than several other previous affixes.
It is because do you really think they will all do “weekly no leavers”? Especially not if their key doesn’t deplete.
Everyone who would not have a key, will now retain it because it doesn’t downgrade.
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All I know is I’m stuck at around 615 on my main. I’ve began leveling alts. I can’t get crests. I’m in an enormous guild and the problem seems pretty common.
Most people that play wow are regular people, and regular people are stuck. I don’t want to keep running delve after delve to fill a vault for a slight chance at receiving one item I need, that, if I’m lucky might push my ilvl up one more point. I already know 619 is it for me. I’m a resto druid and healing the content I currently run is arduous and painful. It’s exhausting. I’m not having fun. This isn’t a good experience for someone like me that bought a 1.5k computer, the expansion, tokens, etc… and is already getting frustrated. I will simply stop playing and go back to playing something else, and spend my money on game pass on my series X instead. I have free time and disposable income. I enjoy a challenge, but I do not want to be frustrated or waste an entire week worth of my free time to get nowhere. Racing through this extremely hard content isn’t fun, and the handful of mythics ive ran have not rewarded me with anything at all except a few gold. It’s a slap in the face. There’s no way I’m the minority and the majority of players have more time, skill, and are sadistic enough to want to jump through enormous hoops to further distance themselves from the majority of the player base. I was worried about being left behind but it seems like the ones that are going to be all alone are the few that have the self-harm-level of willingness to subject themselves to such a sadistic “game”. I want to ENJOY myself not be frustrated and pissed off.
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People will reach the ilvl cap wherever it is, for the content they do.
You can do faceroll content where more gear won’t really make a difference but you choose not to.
That’s why wow has varying difficulty levels.
Wow, bringing self-harm into the mix. Your entire post seem to be an issue with that there is content in the game not aimed at you.
Whatever ilvl drops, even if you have the best gear, you’ll be in the same situation, just bored at a higher ilvl.
And if there was no more content, then you’d be in the same situation because you’ve beaten everything.
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No, that isn’t true. My progress was linear until the transition from runed crests to the next level unobtainum crests. That makes all of the gear I have stuck where it is.
Honestly, your opinion is irrelevant to me, you and one or two others keep pushing this sweatlord agenda that I’m not interested in. Simply put there’s nothing between heroic and mythic that continues the linear progression I’ve had this far. It’s this enormous jump into a horribly tuned dungeon system with no easy queue process and nasty players that need to touch grass desperately. Every single thing I am able to do now rewards useless items, if anything at all. It’s not just me either. Give it a week or two and the forums will be absolutely flooded with frustrated players and subs will drop because a lot of players like me that may enjoy the game but have no problem unsubscribing for another decade or forever.
No one is going to convince me that getting 5 of the same cloak in a row from the last t8 delves I ran, and nothing at all from the hardest content in the game, is fun or rewarding. That certainly was not the emotions I felt when I turned the game off.
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Your progress is not linear. You speed through say normal dungeons, quickly go to whatever cap.
I guess you figured out that money can’t buy you skill.
Instead of running delves why don’t you run keys at your level and improving? You are frustrated and exhausted because you are punching above your means in addition to being so gear focused instead of just playing the game for fun.
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It’ll still downgrade after not timing, just not to a level that would remove an affix of the key. Vault remains unchanged.
It will forever remain 10 or higher.
No, because if you can’t time a +10 then you won’t get a +10 in your vault, it’ll drop to a +9.
With a week, someone will be able to time a mists…
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So they time a +10 the system would be working as intended.
No, it wouldn’t. It creates a huge blight on the key system given all the failures.
I have to agree. This season the dungeons are super unfun. Part of it is due to the change where you if you stun a mob it doesn’t lock it’s cast so it just continuously chain casts. I wish blizzard would learn that a pack with 60000 mobs that chain cast is not fun, nor is it rewarding. It’s annoying.
Also, I echo what the OP said where the dungeons are harder, AND less rewarding. I legitimately feel like the crest threshold of last expansion was far better balanced and felt more fun because there was a clear path to getting gear and ramping up to those gear breakpoints.
I also feel like the dungeons themselves are just conceptually not fun and I realize that is very much a subjective take and others may feel differently but my perspective is this:
- We have a ton of dungeons that have chain casting mobs where if you have more than 1 caster you pretty much can’t do the dungeon on a higher level because you wont have enough kicks, and because stuns or CC’s no longer lock spell casting you run into comp gating much earlier.
- Stonecore and grim batol get special mention because these dungeons suck. They are just anti-fun. Stonecore has mobs that just turbo slap your tank after a short amount of time which then makes it rewarding to kite and we all know that tanks play tank so they can kite /s. Grimbatol is an old dungeon that wasn’t fun when it was current and it’s not fun now. Not to mention that the 3rd boss makes pugs lose their mind and become actual terrorists. I would rather have Grimrail again than grimbatol.
- Death timers combined with lack of rewards for going over time yield a system that rewards you more for leaving a key after a wipe/death than staying and finishing it. when that happens, toxicity blooms and players stop playing.
- Valorstones suck and they don’t make sense to be in the game. Please remove. no one likes farming their crests just to turn around and not have crappy valor stones. I think I speak for everyone when I say that I would rather have discounts on crests than valorstones every time. Especially since gear tracks now have more upgrades than previously
- The vault rewards for the various contents make no sense. A level 8 delve rewards 616 gear. heroic raid rewards 610 gear. Clearly a level 8 is easier than heroic raid. It’s not even a questions and it’s not even close. In m+, you don’t get 616 gear until you complete a 6 or 7. These rewards are so out of touch compared to the effort required to do them. If you want to make a level 8 delve yield 616 gear, I’m all for it, but make that even across the board for the same amount of effort.
Maybe I’m the only one experiencing this, but I am just not having fun this expac. I hope season 2 gets much better, but the amount of lag coupled with what I view as really bad mythic plus experience and a boring/bad raid has made me just not want to log on.
I mean, this first season so far can be summed up, based off of my perspective, is we have a spider raid that you almost can’t play unless you have crab mode on because crab mode improves your FPS drastically. what? fix your crap blizzard. It’s clearly a memory leak in one of the new spider models.
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The problem is that 619s progress to +10, meaning they use their keys to get +10. There is a huge discrepancy between the people who have M+ on the farm aka weekly vaults and others who are progging M+.
Let’s say you have all timed 9s at 619 and trying to pug 10s. You would never join +10 on a group finder. You are a third-class citizen on a group finder because the other people will apply +10 at 630s who timed 10-12s. The solution is using your key or finding a guild group.
Using your key is always a risk and problem. Let’s say you have +10 City of Threads or +10 whatever key people don’t want to do for a weekly vault. +10 City of Threads is very vulnerable to depleted keys without completion. You are in trouble because you will stick with +8/+9 City of Thread.
In my opinion, pugged mythic raiding is 2 times easier than progging your keys to +10.
My mage alt is close to 619 and I haven’t done keys since 2 weeks ago. Depleted keys and gilded crests reduction are the reasons that stopped me from playing M+ on my alts. Gilded crest reduction is when you have 639 in all slots and no one has that unless you are in the top 100 raiding guild or something.
It would be better to remove or replace the affixes. The affix that they should completely remove is Xal’atath’s Bargain: Oblivion. I have no solution for this affix except to remove this affix. Oblivion has 0 counterplay when you have bad interactions. For example, the twin boss in Stonevault jumps to the middle for a cube mechanic, you can’t soak orbs and they get 5+ stacks, the tankbuster will one-shot tanks with zero counterplay. Tredova on Obvillion was so bad, Tredova stands in an instant death puddle cluster 100/100 times so you can’t stand and absorb the orbs very easily.
I disagree, I think it’ll be a great change because people can actually just restart their key and try to time it at the break point. For people who are trying to push keys this is a really nice feature to have, and for pugs it means that their keys won’t constantly get bricked by others.
What kind of “blight on the key system” are you thinking of? If you share your perspective I might understand what I could be missing here.
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