You keep claiming that elitists love shoving these mounts or achieves in your face, yet you are the one here repeatedly bringing those things up. You are dying without those things because mommy and daddy never told you no. You do not need everything. Trivializing the game just to ensure you get all rewards is horrible game design. Big shocker here, online MMO with group content requires rng and repeat play so groups can actually form. Instead of your fantasy where you get your stuff mailed to you week one and have no further incentive to do said content. Which then punishes the rest of the game that actually want to do said content. Thankfully you are just a spoiled casual with no chance at developing a game.
I finished tanking a 10 today, 2 guildies and 2 pugs, we went +3 on the timer.
I didnât feel like it was hard at all.
Assuming you are talking about doing M8 on this druid, thatâs your problem. I went +3 in an M10 at 633 iLVL, being 612 iLVL is too low for an M8 unless you have the skill to go with it.
In reality you should be getting to 619 minimum before stepping into an M7 because you can do that for free by just farming T8 delves.
The problem with you lot is that you donât know the difficulty scaling and what is required with each jump in key levels, you assume âItâs only an 8â and fail because you were not ready for it, simply because you have not ran enough keys to know what the lower ones are like.
On your druid you have timed an M2 and an M5, that is by far not enough experience to go in with your iLVL, itâs just not. You need to remember the gear rewards stop at 10, which is myth track gear, that gets you to 639 iLVL, M8 is only 2 key levels below that, running them at 612 is like trying to do mythic raiding in LFR gear.
I agree each key level itself is too much of a jump once you get past M10, which is being addressed for S2, but going under M10 and failing, thatâs a gear and/or skill issue. Iâm tired of people being like âItâs onlyâŚâ and not even realising what is going on and wiping.
And thatâs not just for keys, but I still see wipes in LFR because players just assume itâs easy and go in woefully underprepared.
And it comes down to âtakes more timeâ - thatâs the difficulty. The one you objected to. Your entire argument came down to "taking more time causes more difficulty or XYZ reasons.
On Fort weeks, youâre still using those defensives on trash before the boss, and still needing them on the boss regardless of Tyr or not. And therefor they still arenât ready for after the boss going into the next trash pack. This is just simply CD management 101.
Again, youâre admitting the difficulty is time which you said it wasnât:
I didnât object to the causal statement that âtake more timeâ > âmore difficultâ. I objected to the blanket statement you keep making that taking more time doesnât add difficulty. I objected to your refusal to acknowledge the dominoes that result in a more difficult experience from things like talent choices for certain specs.
At the surface level, yes you are correct, the only impact of having fortified and tyrannical in a +10 is that more time is required to burn through the higher health, but you ultimately needed to be able to pull off the same pulls and bosses. But there are downstream implications of enemies having higher health that many times lead to situations that are more difficult to get through.
Though if I really want to get technical, requiring more time also plays into the risk management associated with the timer I was implying in my previous post; Iâll leave that alone for nowâŚ
I never made that claim. I said number wise, adding Fort and Tyr together in the same key doesnât make it more difficult as theyâre not combined together.
You fight trash on itâs own. Therefor itâs only a 10% scaling difficulty from 9 to 10 like an 8 to 9. And likewise, youâre not fighting trash the same time youâre fighting a boss, so thereâs no compounding there either, itâs just a 10% increase from key scaling just like an 8 to a 9.
Having to change routes or pulls based around CD management isnât suddenly new to 10s, so thatâs not added difficulty. Thatâs been there since +4s
And this is why routes and things change the higher you go. Again, this all goes back to CD management 101 and is present from as low as 4s. Itâs nothing new that happens at a 10 with adding Tyr and Fort
Correct. But again, this goes to adjusting pulls and CD usage. The actual difficulty of the dungeon of the 10 change, mathematically that is.
The difficulty level dropped disproportionately for one season and now blizzard are trying to put it back where it was before and people are screaming bloody murder.
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The question isnât whether itâs new, itâs whether itâs more difficult. And if you go from needing 1 defensive during the pull before a boss to needing 2, thatâs one fewer defensive at your disposal for the boss. Yes, updating to more efficient routing might allow you overcome that loss, but itâs going to do so by making some aspect of the route more difficult to execute.
But what about the mathematical differences of adjusting those pulls and CD usages? Sure, the track you drive at is the same whether itâs 70 degrees/sunny or 30 degrees/rainy, but these two scenarios wonât have the same level of difficulty to complete/post a good time.
Not necessarily. Thatâs why routes update. To make things easier. And if Iâm needing 2 defensives on a pack before the boss, guess whatâŚthat first one is on cooldown and refreshing before the boss. Just as is the second one.
The dungeon does not become more challenging with the addition of 10s and Fort + Tyr both being active. Player participation and activities are not tied to dungeon tuning. I could take an entire group of 560s into a +7, doesnât suddenly make 7s harder than 10s because of MY actions.
Yes player actions change how they perceive the challenge or the difficulty. But it does not change the difficulty of the dungeon itself. Therefore, a 10 is no more challenging than the 10% key scaling thatâs added.
Does a mobs damage or health pool change depending on which mobs I pull before it? No? Then there are no mathematical differences. They will just be 10% stronger than they were in the key previously. That is it. Thatâs 100% the difficulty increase of the dungeon.
Trash is 10% more difficult than they were on 9 Fort weeks
Bosses are 10% more difficult than they were on 9 Tyr weeks.
Unless this is the first or second week and youâre really pushing keys while being undergeared, that 10% isnât going to change anything. As I had mentioned before, going into a Tyr boss after Fort trash doesnât change anything. Even on Fort weeks, you needed the defensives at the ready for the boss, buffed by 10s Tyr or not.
Itâs a +10 Fort with buffed bosses. You donât treat bosses any differently on Tyr weeks than you do on Fort weeks (save for a few lust spots). Defensives need used at the same times for the same abilities.
No, itâs clear that people do want it to just be face roll. Blizzard was clear that rewards should correlate to the difficulty of the content. If people canât do a 10 then they do need to âget goodâ. Lowering the bar for a +10 goes against their own stated philosophy.
+10 is where the gear rewards top out.
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Classic WoW and Season 3 of DF proves you wrong.
It is in fact what ppl want and it is good design.
However it does annoy the people who base their entire personality on tryharding a 20 year old computer game in their spare time and who then proceed to rationalize said tryhard behaviour as some sort of virtuous deed that ´´deserves`` reward.
Blizzard probably screwed up the tuning, I honestly don´t think they ever intended to make the season that easy and now S3 will always be living proof that you can actually make the game popular and fun by having it just be a complete joke.
The debate is over.
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Ignoring classic because thatâs wildly not as popular as people presume and focusing on DF:
This only works with your assumption that 100% of players touching content a single time is better. S3 of DF had an extra 10 keys at the bottom ranks, was vastly easier than any season since DF launch if not earlier, and TWW S1 is still one of the most popular seasons of M+ even with smaller player population from the shift back onto Chinese servers, higher entry level for keys being placed at the old +12 range, and proper difficulty scaling. M+ is still popular without being trivial, youâd see that if you were checking numbers or playing instead of posting on the forums exclusively.
what are you smoking my guy. Classic wow you are basically guaranteed to NOT get everything. Dragonflight season 3 still had all the same stuff you are complaining about. You keep projecting this deep psychology at play proves who the actual weirdo is here. You like to be a victim we get it.
No, looks like youâre right. I was thinking the masters achievements, whoops. I have one KSH and one Iâm about to get this season on warrior.
The devs said that the mythic scale slid down by 10, correct? 1=11, 5=15, 10=20. I sure wasnât doing 20 to get that other KSH, but Iâm doing 10 now, which is theoretically the same based on what the devs said.
You definitely donât need full 10s to get 2500.
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They said they deleted +2-11 so effectively they are -10 from before in key number. As for rewards, they change this all the time and at certain point in the past were +20 for top rewards. It wasnât always +16 or +18.
Regardless, +10 this season is easier than a +20 DF S1 or +20 SL S1. Key numbers on their own mean nothing. What matters is the base M0 tuning and the key scaling.
8s should be easy for even casual players at this point in the season. You donât need to be sweaty neckbeards; just do some interrupts and pop a defensive once in a while.
Really? It looks that way on mine, or at least half 10s, but who knows. Hereâs my warriorâs ratings:
Ara-Kara 10 - 329
Necrotic Wake 10 - 324
SoB 9 - 302
Stonevault 9 - 301
DB 9 - 300
GB 9 - 296
Tirna 8 - 286
CoT 9 - 276
And the total is 2413, so I still need 87 points. Some of these dungeons have failed over and over again when I pug them and waste entire nights in an attempt to advance. Itâs just a crapshoot. As the tank, Iâm not sure what I can doâsurvive harder? lol. The dps are usually dropping like flies on various bosses.
You need 6/8 +10 timed and 2/8 +9 timed.
So almost full 10âs, got it
I would like to do m+ again, maybe one day when they are fun
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