You literally said “End of dungeon 405 is awful from a +20”. How is that not being motivated by gear?
Again, if you’re not motivated by gear, why does it matter if M+ drops lower ilvl gear if keys are tuned in a way where you won’t notice a difference?
Because currently, which is all we have to go off of, you cannot realistically walk into +20s with +19 gear on.
Unless you’re already playing at that level to begin with.
Bro if i had 402 gear on my stats would be legit awful. But I don’t push M+ for gear, I play to push
gear is a stepping stone
pve content is all considered one and the same tho
theres a hard line drawn between pve and pvp (rightfully so, im in the camp that pvp is now a tacked on minigame lol) but not between m+ and raiding
i think the idea is that people do both, which is actually how it plays out most of the time
id concede to bumping the mythic ilvl dropping from higher keys (i think 22 is fair based one how keys have felt compared 421 bosses, tho the keys all feel different especially because of affixes), but then your camp mythic raiders would complain about how much of a nuisance it is to have to run 22s now
right back to square 1
Are you new to video games? Since when do you get stuff for free? If you need to beat a game on hard to unlock something, are you going to complain to the devs that you should be able to unlock it by beating the game on easy?
We are doing M+ to get the gear. What are you even saying
I’m telling you, if your goal is to get people into mythic raiding i just fail to see how making any of these people in this thread unhappy is the way to go about it.
This is a reach if I ever did see one. Yikes. You’re something else, champ!
the reward from m+ is points
huge io
reward from raid is accomplishing progression with people you get to know through ~overcoming adversity and challenges~
my mindset going into raid is “lets hope this is the night we finally down that stupid spider”
my mindset going into a key is “timing this on a 22/23 from a 21 would be huge points”
i only think about gear on tuesday
Gear is a stepping stone in this game.
Well then they should fix that. You don’t need +19 gear to be equal to mythic gear to fix that issue, they just need to itemize better between key levels.
Point still stands.
I can’t get behind some logic of “make others unhappy instead of improving what is wrong”
surely this will get people to raid.
surely.
Nope.
Okay, I agree with that.
My point is I don’t care about M+ points or io. At all. I shouldn’t have to keep running keys for gear because it’s better than Heroic gear. Most people running keys don’t even bother with raiding because outside of maybe a couple weapons, there’s no reason to.
They need to make them separate, but the only way I can see to achieve that is to make M+ gear equal to Heroic gear, and tune M+ accordingly. But then that brings the issue of people complaining that “mythic gear is better than M+ gear and that’s not fair”. Even if people say they’re not gear-motivated, they’re still going to complain.
Explain how that’s a reach. Games have always worked that way. Do something harder and you get a better reward. How is that incorrect?
And our point is that it won’t make people want to raid more.
This thread is proof of that, I’m proof of that. I’m not going to randomly want to pick up and extra day of raiding because m+ loot is worse LOL and apparently nobody else in this thread would either
You know what would make me want to raid more however? If I could progress with 7 different raid teams every single week. At any progression point that I wanted to participate in.
its not being gear-motivated, just that m+ infinitely scaled. having to do something you dont want to in order to progress because youre hitting a wall gear-wise feels bad
sure you can relate
better to incentivize people to raid by making it more fun/rewarding than making m+ less rewarding
it would actually just annoy raiders because theyre stuck at the mercy of pitiful loot drops
20s are more difficult than heroic bosses. sans maybe rasz but it depends on the key
The point is not to make people want to raid more? It’s to make it so raiders are not forced to do keys for gear.
You can. Just gear up 7 characters.
One sided thought process. That’s enough of this convo for me.
Hard to look past your own world though.
Tried to look at it from both sides but at this point there’s pretty much no point in continuing this conversation
Because no one was talking about getting free anything. That’s an argument for another kind of thread. You swung and you missed. You’ll be okay.
Agreed.
I even raid.
I just don’t even understand what they think that making m+ loot worse does besides make people unhappy LOL
imagine clearing a +20 and u get a 402 piece in the vault, or whatever the equivalent in S2 is.
i get sockets rn so id maybe be happy for the tmog 