He soloed it then went to the bathroom.
This is really the correct solution to the problem.
Want to take bets on that being the case when it rotates back in?
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I think the issue for most of the people complaining is that the jump from heroic to m0 (which if I recall is effectively an old +10) is a bit too large. I tend to agree that it is, especially given how Blizzard implemented previous seasons. Going from laughably easy to âwhoa this got serious in a hurryâ with nothing in between is shocking for most casuals. Definitely a bigger jump than LFR to normal to heroic, etc.
However, I also support the argument that things like heroic dungeons and LFR were put in the game (or rather kept in the game in the case of dungeons) specifically for casuals. You see the dungeons/raids, get the story, get some slightly better loot than WQs and still experience most of the game. If they (casuals) want to challenge themselves, the options are there, but are by no means necessary or required to enjoy the game.
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I did a full tour of m0âs today on a character that started at 469 iLvL, which is significantly lower than you could be by spamming heroic dungeons.
If m0 is too hard for you, IDK what to say.
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This makes sense, the difficulty of old 0s was roughly equal to current heroics so the criteria should adjust. Personally I tend to think this is rewarding far too much for far too little effort, but I have alts to work on as well, the quicker the better.
Get rid of M0 as a concept.
Buff heroics to a bit below current M0s, mythic mechanics, and make them drop veteran gear and your starter mythic keystone.
There, itâs fixed.
I could see maybe a small ilvl bump but they donât have much room before it starts becoming LFR level. That and it would have to come with the fight mechanics enabled, after all every seems to think they should prepare you for mythic 0.
My mistake.
Imo, it should just start at M1 and just go up from there.
M0 in and of itself, is weird because itâs supposed to be a learning experience/stepping stone for higher M+, yet isnât queuable like Heroics are.
M0 is treated as endgame like M+ keystones are, yet at the same time, itâs not lol. You donât get anything special from doing M0 dungeons, like pushing keystones give you.
Just make M0 the new Heroic and call it a day.
They wonât make it queueable because it gives normal raid level gear, thus why i say they should just remove it, make heroics have M0 mechanics and make it drop veteran gear. With those changes heroic dungeons would be the mythic equivalent of what LFR is for raids. Maybe tune damage and health values on enemies a bit to make it an actual challenge unlike what heroics are today.
Iâm not telling you to leave, but if you compensate the DPS you need to compensate everyone, so if you see a bad DPS doing lower than tank level DPS and make it so they can do more, you need to allow everyone to do more, so the tank will still be doing more.
Yes because if we compensate bad players and allow them to do 300K, the better players will be pulling 900K, then the bad players will complain, compensate them to 900K and the better players will end up doing 2.7 million DPS.
Itâs the same argument every time, make M0 easier, but why just M0, why not M2? Why not M5? Then they make normal raid easier to allow bad players to finish that raid, but already once players are geared you are finding them 1 man tanking on some bosses, when does it ever end?
Itâs a never ending rollercoaster, the moment you put something, anything in place to allow bad players to magically be better, everyone else will also be better. If someone is bad they will never compete with better players, and if they make it only so someone doing low damage gets to do more, then everyone will just get worse and worse and more lazy, you may as well just play Animal Crossing or MLP if thatâs what you think needs to happen.
If you are bad you are bad, there is nothing Blizzard should ever do balancing wise because it just wonât stop. If you think parts of the game are inaccessible to you because you are not good enough, get better.
Weâve had this discussion before many times over the years, it started back in Wrath when the first heroic raids happened, people like you complained you could not get into raiding because it was too hard so they made it easier.
Then the better players complained it was too easy, so they gave us heroic raiding, players further whined the game is too hard so they gave us LFR, players kept whining that they were not able to participate in all modes of the game and that it was âinaccessibleâ, so they made heroic and normal easier and added in mythic raiding.
Players KEPT complaining, and still are until this very day, it never stops. It happened the same with M+, it happened the same with over world content, it happens all the time, every time no matter what Blizzard try and do.
In DF we didnât just see complaints about how hard the game is, we seen for the first time basically ever about how easy the game is, so they changed M+ and mythic dungeons and made them harder. And now that they have made them harder, not even a week into the season, complaints about how hard it is started, again.
There is a reason there are four raids, three dungeon levels and a potential 22-25 key levels to go through, to ensure there is content for everyone so we can all play the game, we can all see all the content the game has to offer, we can all participate and have a chance at getting the same loot, it might not be the same strength, but we can still all participate and have a chance.
You want Fyrakks axe? Go for it, all four difficulties offer a chance to see it. You want the Evoker weapon? It still has a chance to drop in LFR. Drake skins? I got the Fyrakk one in LFR and the Raz one in a normal guild run. Bullions can be obtained in LFR, trinkets can be obtained in heroic and upgraded, tier pieces can be made via the catalyst, there is literally no better time to be playing this game than right now.
If someone is not good enough to go past M0 or LFR then so be it, but itâs a far cry better than it was when bad players were just straight up excluded from all forms of content.
People cried that heroics werenât relevant. Blizz makes heroic relevant, now people cry that they donât want to do heroics and want to go to m0. Maybe itâs not the same batch crying about the issues but Iâm willing to bet there is some heavy overlap.
Also 476 gear from heroic, a couple 480 pieces from the boxes, 2 pieces of crafted gear and you should be 480+ ilvl. Plus a single bullion item from lfr.
If the content is hard for you, then you should be trying to make the most of the gear you have available. Sent 4 m0s on alts this week for bullion with my friends at/around 470-480 characters and only ruby felt at all spicy.
No I am almost certain itâs mostly the same people. The same people making posts like this telling us M0 is too hard because it takes too long to farm heroics, not noticing that in S3 and earlier you would farm M2-10 to get to the same level M0 is now, itâs the same farm time, some players just cannot comprehend any of this or flat out refuse to listen and learn.
What I see from this player base, and not just from thee posts, but from what I see in game with players at 500 iLVL pulling 20K DPS and dying to everything, is that they just want something for nothing.
âHeroics donât offer enoughâ
OK, so letâs increase the difficulty and rewards accordingly.
âNO NOT LIKE THATâ
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Maybe Iâm getting here too late, but I second this. You can face roll your keyboard through a heroic. Yes I have seen people die in occasion, but those are outliers. Bosses can die before a mechanic even goes off. I personally think 476 is good ilvl for most specs to succeed at m0. You can also upgrade them and get your vault at the end of the week. The world content helps as well. You may be able to get some gear in the awakened LFR, which you should be doing to get your weekly Bullion anyway. All that being said, the scaling is tough in pug groups. I appreciate that m0 has been made relevant, but the gaps between levels are larger now. I agree that m0 should not have a lockout so people can learn and farm gear.
I feel like delves are going to offer an alternative progression path that will fill the gap here. Itâs just not released yet.
I think that they arenât paying much attention to retail right now unfortunately, with the new expansion coming so soon with such a tight deadline. Iâd love to be wrong!
I should start off by saying I havenât actually tried the m0âs myself. However itâs pretty obvious the balance is off if so âmanyâ casuals are struggling for whatever reason. Whatâs the point of m+ if these players are getting stuck at m0. Blizzard is known for making things either too easy or too hard and it is hard to balance these things, just look at diablo 4.
In any way when it comes to balancing of content itâs always better to aim low than too high. Either way m+ would have stopped them in their tracks, no reason for m0 to do it is what Iâm saying.
if theyre getting stuck at m0 theyre gonna get stuck at m +2
i think the change will feel better in TWW
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Maybe the in between is already thereâŚM1. Just tweak the difficulty of M0 and gear rewards, and then basically make M1 what M0 is now.
Except that Blizzard didnât make M+ easier for better players in the pursuit of offering easier scaled versions of it for worse players. If a +5 is too easy for you, a +6 is right there waiting for you. Blizzard doesnât have to compromise your gameplay experience as a player running +32s in order to accommodate the player whose most appropriate difficulty level is a +2. Players like you quickly work up the ladder to the point where those worse players wonât be in your keys, at which point their presence in tiers below you shouldnât impact your gameplay experience in the slightest.
I mean even with the criminally undertuned DF S3, worse players were able to reach higher than they ever could. But that also meant you could reach higher and still reach tiers out of their reach. With the exception of preparing a new character for keys, there is zero cost to better players for there to exist lower tier levels for players that want/need it.
This is just a bad faith argument, though. The reason people are crying isnât because heroics were made relevant, itâs that Blizzard ALSO greatly elongated the step between heroics and the next difficulty in the chain. Itâs going from 10 tiers of progression in between those points to none. Now Iâm not saying the game needed 10 tiers in that range, but for anyone that benefited from there being more than 0 tiers there, the gameplay options available to them are much worse.
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