Honestly, ZG is where guilds give all the meme specs their gear cause 99% of the raiders don’t need it anyway. ZG iz 4 Fun.
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Sad thing is this has actually been confirmed from a Vanilla Dev that ret paladin would get nerfed any time they got close to beating a Warrior.
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Really? Can you find that? Super interesting.
proper gear stats and consumables are even more important, though.
Right and with the perfection of both you still give garbage dps.
Try Reforged without caps. Also you may be able to search via my name. I don’t want to give you the names of the players in our guild who actually run the add on for logs. EDIT: It should come up on the website, we are 1 out of 2 Horde raiding guilds on the server.
Yeah I don’t play ret. but thanks lol
It doesn’t sound like a meme spec problem, it sounds like you have a bad guild problem. I see a lot of ret paladins on my server, and in my guild, with top of the line DPS weapons and full judgment or even the bwl/mc dps plate pieces that normally go to warriors. Getting stuck with Nightfall is one thing, I can see doing that for the benefits of the guild as a whole and then switching to your real weapon in pvp or other pve activities. Not being able to get a lot of loot though is definitely a choice your specific guild has made and you probably shouldn’t have stuck around.
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Do resto shaman totem twist GoA if they are in the warrior group? If not, a 4.5% crit increase seems ok.
Yes we do.
As a paladin couldn’t you go with a 33/0/18 spec or something similar and heal but also still have SoC and the extra crit when you want to pvp?
It’s actually worse overall unless your guild has almost exclusively casters in all its DPS slots. You’ll get more overall DPS by equipping a proper DPS 2h weapon than you would a nightfall from now until forever.
The only nightfall is good for is giving a slightly higher parse for mages and locks, but parsing is something I see as a personal concern - not a concern of the group.
There comes a point where one must ask themselves; “Am I playing World of Warcraft, or am I playing Warcraftlogs?”
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Sad maybe in hindsight, but the design of the old days of WoW, even through WoTLK was not about every spec being competitive on the meters to be considered valuable, but some offering some sort of unique utility. Elemental used to bring a spell hit/crit totem (changed to SP bonus later), and all shamans brought bloodlust. Arms brought a 4% physical debuff, spriests were mana batteries, etc. List goes on, I think initially a lot of them were very spec unique, and hunters may be able to bring a specific one through a pet.
The only sad thing about Vanilla utility is that the “meme” specs that brought utility weren’t unique so going back to the OP you should just be resto or holy and bring that same utility anyways. Through TBC and WoTLK that utility wdesign was more fleshed out and specs got rounded out so their DPS wasn’t so terrible that you next level worthless, but they were also throttled by complaints from pures if they ever were seen as too strong because people playing pures would get uppity if their class, which could only perform DPS, was not one of the clearly dominant specs on the meters.
I find this hard to believe, especially going forward with AQ where fire mages are going to start bringing the pain, the fact that Nightfall is a static % increase means it gets better with everyone getting more geared. I want to say warlocks become a bit more front and center too, but not as sure as fire mages.
I’m sure there’s a rough breakpoint you should be able to figure out for that, realistically a paladin or shaman should be carrying a personal DPS item and Nightfall and swap to whatever is more beneficial given the comp.
That’s the main problem with classic wow, people try to make it into a hyper competitive game because today’s gaming culture is all about that. You have a 15 year old RPG that’s played like it’s League of Legends or Call of Duty or Mythic raids in retail WoW.
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yup. It’s actually quite good and can hold it’s own in small burst windows.
You will not do as much damage as a full ret - but you will have way more utility.
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That was my initial thought as well, but it turns out the contribution gained from nightfall is so low that even with the caster power spikes, having proper DPS weapon/gearing on the would-be nightfall wielder is still more raid DPS.
It’s all because of its 1ppm rate; it’s so inconsistent and unreliable, that for every noticeable gain seen from it, there are probably 10 times where you’d have more raid DPS from that player wielding almost any of the raid 2h weapons. This is especially true when weighing it against weapons like ashkandi or hand of rag, which almost no one else wants anyways because dual-wielding is so much better in PvE.
If you were to pour over the logs of those who are/were using nightfall, you’ll see just how bad and inconsistent its uptime is. Math out the DPS gained from that vs the DPS gained from the same class and spec wielding an actual DPS weapon, and it’s not even close to being in favor of nightfall.
Unless nightfall receives its 2ppm, as it actually had in vanilla, it will forever be a waste of mats and a debuff slot. That said, it is still a very good pre-raid weapon that will hold up nicely until its user gets something better.
It’s kind of the same situation with the hunter T2 8 piece; yeah the proc is good…if it procs. It’s just too unreliable and inconsistent to consider as an overall gain.
Well 2H Fury is more prominent on Horde though, courtesy of WF so a lot of 2H weapons on Horde are highly sought after, especially something like OEB.
But if what you say is true it just kind of highlights how unnecessary the specs are anyways and theoretically shouldn’t be played. Realistically IME most guilds aren’t fretting about a few people playing a “worthless” spec like that and a good guild is either using a DKP type system or allowing free rolls regardless of meme spec or not which means they should be getting the gear they want as they can. Our moonkin was able to grab the first Nef Staff that dropped cause he dumped all his DKP on it.
just dropping in to say i have been having a blast and enjoy playing ret
middle of the pack alongside some hunter mages and warlocks - clearing mc and bwl just fine every week. got ashkandi and its super fun in pvp!
Enjoy all!
you was figurative.
This is false. WF, TA/GoA, CH, CH, CH, WF…
This is also false. You have Grace of Air too.