Nah, Blood Elf posters aren’t worth being taken that seriously.
Going to address your post as a whole rather than point by point.
I am not blaming you personally for a lack of timely rebellion. Only that it reflects poorly on the Horde’s good guy identity (I argue its lack of existence but that’s another topic).
You keep saying morally depraved warchiefs like they are the only cause for all this.
You had Northrend incident in Icecrown that the Horde soldiers ambushed and attacked Alliance as they were fighting the scourge.
You had the Horde following Garrosh and Sylvanas as they wiped off multiple towns and villages off the map.
And then they blew theramore and abducted its citizens to torture in Orgrimmar.
ALL THIS. And its just 1 guys fault? Really?
The Horde was supposed to be clean after Garrosh and we got Sylvanas.
Blizzard decided to make the entire Horde ACTIVELY complicit.
Sylvanas says burn it and every single soldier leaps to obey. No resistance or even some small effort to undo the evil deed.
Did the Shamans try to lessen the damage or make it worse?
Did the Horde try to save anyone?
Did the Horde after the fact self reflect or tone down their aggression?
The answer to all of that is a resounding NO.
Shamans did their best to make sure no one had the time to flee.
The Horde after such tragedy not only defended Sylvanas when she was about to get some Alliance justice but also decided to blight, desecrate and torture PoWs.
ALLLLL THIS. and it is just ONE warchief that destroys the ideals of the Horde to the shock and horror of all the good Horde?
If there are so many good Horde out there why don’t I see them? What have they done that I can see that shows they try to make amends?
The answer so far seems to be there isn’t any. The Horde leaders are unapologetic and self righteous despite everything they have done.
I have no problem with this portrayal. Every story needs a baddie but to sit there and tell me the problem is just ONE character?
Come on.
JUST ONE?
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To my understanding the Purge was quite bugged (or Blizz is using that excuse to explain away some things they wanted to back track on). I don’t recall every playing through it cause I refused to play the Theramore stuff.
I do want to point out that Theramore occurred first. Her reaction of wanting to destroy Garrosh’s city in retaliation is relatable in a way that Theramore isn’t. It is only natural to want to respond to such an event by lashing out. That said Thrall was able to talk her out of it. Speaking volumes about how she was a better character than Garrosh or Sylvanas who takes no dissention.
The Purge shouldn’t have happened because all the principle players that should have stopped it had (of varying degrees) lapses of judgement that is quite common place in the real world today. Neither Jaina nor Vereesa should have been allowed into that position following Theramore.
Also Jaina doesn’t have the history Sylvanas does. Jaina didn’t create plagues and blights. That was Sylvanas.
Jaina didn’t knowingly and openly employ a Dreadlord, that was Sylvanas (to the predicted end no less).
Jaina didn’t turn Southshore into the slime pit, Sylvanas did.
Jaina didn’t invade and blight Gilneas, that was Sylvanas.
Jaina didn’t try and enslave Eyir, that was Sylvanas.
Jaina doesn’t kill people and raise them into undeath, that is Sylvanas.
Jaina was talked down from destroying a city full of civilians, Sylvans wasn’t.
Jaina doesn’t kill people wanting to defect from her leadership peacefully, Sylvanas does. [Thank You Amadis]
Jaina didn’t attack a food source on Zandalar. She attacked the fleet and tried to minimize civilian causalities. Sylvanas attacked the food source (Brennadam) and had troops pining civilian parents to walls for their children weep over.
Pointing out the Purge and trying to compare it to the laundry list of stuff Sylvanas has done (and will continue to do) is a double standard.
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She is a defensive strategist. It doesn’t translate to offense though. That was why she needed Saurfang for Teldrassil. She was excellent opposing Arthas’ advance, but can’t seem to push such an advance herself without some sort of superweapon that the other side doesn’t have.
Also she seems limited to military matters. Raising Derek as she did was a political goof, kind along the lines from GoT of Rob Stark backing out of a marriage arrangement to randomly marry someone else thus alienating allies.
Also her having the support of the people still is odd. Given who and what the horde is supposed to be comprised of then what either Treng or Pyrogar said in the past should have been true: “Teldrassil should have broken the Horde. Derek should have broken the Forsaken.”
[I don’t remember which one said it, but I remember what was said.]
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Very similar, yes. If anything, worse, since Malfurion lived, and Rastakhan did not.
To note, I do see the War of the Thorns and the burning of Teldrassil as two events, as I do not hold Saurfang responsible for burning, though I do hold him responsible for the war before that. However, the Zandalar did not have a burning of Teldrassil event, as Shaw pointed out to Saurfang.
But the War of the Thorns and the Battle of Dazar’alor are pretty much the same story told twice with slight variations: The Night Elf civilians were able to hold back the Horde for a time, the Zandalari civilians were not able to hold back the Alliance, and where Malfurion was taken down with an axe to the back he was rescued and lived, while Rastakhan even fully empowered by Bwonsamdi was still through defeated and died.
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Slight nitpick, but Theramore deserters were killed for wanting to start up fighting the Horde again in Classic through Cataclysm.
So you would say the Horde was humiliated to the level of WoT but not yet to the level of burning of teldrassil?
I would say that is accurate, yes.
So we are in agreement that the Horde needs to be humiliated.
That we are in the red when it comes to humiliating the Horde.
So how are you going to reconcile that?
As you can see from responses to my Battlefield: Ashenvale proposal, Horde players feel that the idea of having to atone is humiliating. You earlier asked for Saurfang on his knees. I would say he should end up on his knees in front of Tyrande (again), but that she spares him (again) to make sure he keeps atoning, rather than taking the easy way out of being killed by cop Alliance.
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Point taken, but I was referring to the killing of the forsaken for wanting to leave with their families in BTS not any trying to start a war. Maybe that one could be worded better.
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Nitpick but he suicided with loa juice so its not like we actually killed him plus he wasnt officially horde and had nothing to do with teldraasil so the two acts are hardly equivalent the only thing they have in common is that they suck, one harder than the other but still…
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I feel like a lot of ally posters are gonna be disappointed with the end of bfa, really ever since WoT the alliance has been winning rather a lot.
Raided another horde city
Killed another horde leader (horde have not killed an alliance leader)
Destroyed a horde city (with a successful spy mission)
Destroyed horde navy (horde did not destroy alliance navy)
Like ya’ll have really been winning alot but like never count those as victories.
Somethin tells me its gonna be more of a horde final victory at the end or the horde ‘rebels’ will really outshine the alliance.
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Youre trying to derail the tread with your trolling please refrain to do so, some alliance characters have been educated with their responses to you but you dont try to find common ground with any of them.
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Not ture at all go read the above, iv had many good discussions with people in this thread.
Just because I dont agree with you dosent mean im trolling.
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Yes, it wasn’t so much we killed him as much as Bwonsamdi abandoned him, we left him for dead, and Bwonsamdi’s power actually killed him off.
But still parallel to the Horde attacking one of the Night Elves’ leaders. Except Malfurion lived.
I agree that it is not payback for Teldrassil, since it is indeed fact that the Zandalari had nothing to do with the War of the Thorns or the burning.
But was still pretty much the same plot points with some details different, just with the Zandalari on the receiving end instead of the Night Elves.
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God I want SO BAD for Shaw to be the one who leaves the Alliance Thrones running red with blood! He’s the Master who’s table Anduin serves at (because Anduin over-relies on Shaw to make up for his own extreme inexperience; so he’s marching to the beat of Shaw’s drum much of the time). It would also explain WHY Shaw just seems to be EVERYWHERE in BfA (where as AT LEAST Nathanos “could” be explained as him getting setup to replace Sylvanas when she goes).
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i don’t feel like we are winning, i feel like we are losing… everything.
our self respect as a faction.
Anduin wants to heal the horde and leave them alone after sylvanas is deal with.
now even jaina is with him supporting the rebels who happen to be her friends (baine,thrall)
so is easy to see that she will just let go the hatred in favor of status quo after an event like war of thorns that the only reasonable response would be the extermination of the horde.
tyrande remains as our only hope for vengeance.
like, for real blizzard written elegy with the sole purpose of enrage alliance players so we can give a damn about the dumb faction war.
at least they should have let us destroy lordaeron ourselves…
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GOOD. Maybe we’ll finally listen to Taran Zhu and break the cycle of godawful faction war writing.
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WE NEED BLOOD panda!
the nelfs deserve justice before getting to the status quo!
let the horde be the ones who forgive!
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