I never believed that MC or BWL was going to be very hard in Classic. I do not want MC or BWL to be anywhere close to as challenging as a mythic raid in BFA.
I believe that because of the 1.12 items and talents players will over power these raids and they will present no challenge. I am concerned that the majority of first raids will never experience the submerge phase of Rag because of the increased player power with 1.12 items and talents. I also believe that its very likely Blizzard will do 16 debuff slots from the start of Classic which will only increase a raids power make MC and BWL less challenging.
I dont believe I will enjoy doing MC or BWL with 1.12 items because of this and I dont believe I will feel like I will have earned any loot that I might receive in these raids because of how easy these raids will be with 1.12 items if they are not re-tuned.
In my opinion one of the most Vanilla experiences is feeling like an item was something you worked hard for, earned and got rewarded.
I dont want the mechanics of any of the fights to be changed. I would prefer that Blizzard do some form of progressive itemization where items get at least some of the updates that they got in Vanilla. I dont believe every item needs to go thought every phase it went thought in Vanilla.
I believe its really important that MC is testable in a beta.
Have your considered the 30% defense nerf to tanking gear and the effect it’ll have on tanks, healers, and dps due to threat?
Molten Core will be beaten in the first week. If you buff the bosses in it, like on private servers, then at most it’ll be pushed back to the second week.
There is no point in trying to make Classic inauthentic. If you want a customized challenge, then people have already been doing that for years on private servers (which I do not condone or recommend for the record).
I mean you do realize that most of the gear that “trivializes” MC won’t be available until Phase 2 at least right? That being said, making the fights take longer doesn’t make them harder, it just makes them take longer.
The early tiers in the old model (Vanilla and BC) are easy or “Normal” difficulty.
I don’t see any real issue with them being that way for Classic. It will encourage more people to raid, and get players geared for AQ when it opens.
Remember that historically Razorgore, Vael and Chromaggus were really hard on guilds. For the health of the casual/social raiding community I am not interested in these bosses being buffed, or gear being nerfed.
The second half of the raid content is genuinely challenging. I think it will be fine and I also anticipate that it will be more difficult than people remember/expect.
Oh it’s this thread again.
I disagree with you, I think it’s going to be fine that Molten Core is a bit on the easy side.
BWL will not be easy anyway.
Yes I understand that a lot of items had their defensed reduced in the later part of Vanilla. I dont believe this will have as big as a impact as you are implying it might. But again I really want to see MC tested on the beta.
Yes MC will cleared very fast. And I am ok with it being cleared before I even reach 60. My concern is that most people wont experience things like Rags submerge phase or having to kill adds for killing him or having to clears the area around Shazzrah because the raid cant kill her in less then a minute.
I dont believe I am trying to make Classic inauthentic. I have the concerns that I have and I dont want MC and BWL to feel like LFR raids that reward free loot.
IDK. I think that an experienced player base, who know their characters and the encounters inside / out, will mainly be what enables them to beat the first few raids. I’m still an #NoShieldSlam advocate, but w/e.
Eh… BWL wasn’t crazy hard, but it wasn’t a walk in the park either. MC will be pretty easy with even a few experienced raiders there to guide guilds. I think it’ll be a lot like old Vanilla. On your server several will clear MC, a fair amount will atleast move well into BWL, far fewer will get through AQ40 and actually clear anything in Naxx… mostly because the further you go, the more you have to prep, the harder it is to maintain a roster of dedicated individuals.
There are alot of items that where in patch 1.1 that will also be in phase 1 and received significant buffs in Vanillas life. While alot of the items didnt get buffed to be better then BWL items they did still get buffed and 17 items all getting buffed a little bit adds up.
That’s because the private servers are not Actually Classic WoW and they have literally no way to know how hit, glancing, armor, resist, and threat actually truly worked in vanilla… We only have “Testing” done in actual vanilla that was fairly decent for the time but it’s obviously not going to be the whole story.
Additionally Classic (actual) is using 1.12 for the classes, this alone massively nerfs all the content that came before patch 1.11 because in the pre-1.11 era Tank threat was lower, as a result the raid bosses lasted longer because there were trade offs involved to using fury builds to tank.
Some say that they’re removing gear to get better rage generation, and while that was true to a degree this was done when players out geared the content, not because they were in Naxxramas tanking bosses that factually hit harder.
And that’s the thing, Sure it’s true that as you get better gear you take less damage, but it’s also true that if your raid progresses into harder content where the NPC’s and Bosses hit harder or more frequently that the rage generation problems of more armor are a wash.
It does not take a rocket scientist to figure out that Blizzard was regulating tank rage generation by means of giving them more armor and in addition making the bosses hit harder… Its the obvious and natural path of progression…
The tanks that were running into rage issues were the same derps that over gear them selves thinking they literally need Pre-raid BiS to even set foot in raid…
If Method wants to play Classic and clear raids in one day thats cool. But I am still concerned that the average player and raid will still have so much power MC and BWL will represent “free loot” and the raids wont be rewarding to do.
I am still concerned that the mechanics the fight do have will be trivialized by the increased player power, even when guilds are entering these raids for the first time.