5% more damage on wings, 5% more dr on dp and 20% more damage on fv and boj arent really gamechangers. If fv was doing 1M damage unbuffed I would say ret goes to A tier right away with that 20% buff but not really. Considering we are not really scaling with stats these are pretty much the power curve were were meant to have this tier. We will see but week 2 buffs were not game changers. Funny they buffed boj and fv AGAIN , it seems they cant do math.
Imagine if week 2 the buffs were
30% FV
35% boj
People would have lost their minds.
In the meantime I will abuse ww for the elite set before the nerfs. This is what you forced me into blizzard.
i mean its not just spell warding, its the ability to sac targets without much risk as well, and its constant aoe rupt option. in raids niches dont really do much. you could spellwarding someone out of 20 or your can spellwarden yourself and cheese alot of things like bubble cheesing. so that ends up a net positive for prot when you know what to cheese to make things easier for the whole group.
holy has am yes its a healing cd issue. but it also has baseline devo aura which is more dr overal than am itself. so you cna interchange prot and holy for devo aura and not lose much cause prot has other things alongside devo aura and holy has a pi like buff along side holyshock giving dr as well. hpal has a unique healing cd and thats okay we shouldnt have to nerf it to fit the norm while other healing specs have their own unique utility
ret doesnt really bring anything to keys or raid beyond the standard paladin utility. we had ret aura, there was a reason to bring 2 paladins but that was also cringe to have 2 of one spec mandatory. but that logic goes right out the window now that we say 4 mist weavers or 4 boomies or 4 ww at any given time.
ultimately i think the best solution is to make paladin as a class share all their potential utility. am class wide, blessing of seasons class wide or removed, and spellwarding sharing a node with bop.
Ive been aaying for a while that ret ahould have access to Aura mastery, our class has always had a strong attachment to auras but to have our dps spec not have AM it makes auras feel poopy. Imagine being the only melee class being able to give your team raid wide/party wide silence immunity or even a 20% aoe damage reduction or even be able to give a short term mount boost with crusader aura. It would be really fun to have access to AM as prot or Ret
It wouldn’t be the only melee class to provide aoe damage reduction, as you got DKs amz, or rallying cry (which is made more effective with personals). They also don’t seem to want ret to have much of an ability to heal others as they removed the WoG % increase healing with lower hp on allies and is only applicable to you. Which is at it should be because it’s a dps spec, not a healer.
What it needs is more ST damage because it has no issues keeping itself alive. You do have 1 minute sac and BoP(which other pallies do have except for 1 minute sac on holy) but it also allows a different healer which just further adds more to your groups utility because the only unique utility brings is aura mastery, while something like a shammy has earthen wall, spirit link, and then shaman stuff, or disc priest Dome and pain suppression and the standard stuff they got
I get what you mean but if its really gonna put you in danger you’d use it with bubble for Ret.
But sure, you have more room to play with Sac on prot.
Just like DH sigil.
I’d argue that where DT is positive it’s likely DK Grip is just flat out better at doing what you want to do.
The reality is, raids are always mainly ST with few bosses with adds.
And even with adds usually, between 20 people, even if the AoE kick is nice, its redundant.
I’m not sure I followed you on that.
Ret Devo is the same percentage as Prot and Holy, theirs isn’t stronger.
They do get the option with lightsmith of making it 1% stronger on some people but that’s hardly significant.
I don’t think it should be nerfed either, I just think the mechanic of it should be accessible to maybe 1 more healer.
Yup it doesn’t and it should, doesn’t need to be that big. Many options to choose from a single target Blessing of Kings, an option to make some of the current blessing do something else more potent.
Recompense is degenerate talent but the idea could be right.
Change the name of Sac for Blessing of Retribution and instead of transferring the damage to you, you aim it back at the mobs (it sill reduce damage)
No shenanigans involved with judgement or other abilities, just a good old potent thorn effect.
Plenty of things can be done.
Well its flatly on the back of tuning, not because there was a concerted effort to make it so that by sheer design of class buffs this would happen.
I don’t know about spellwarding, it feels like there’s potential to abuse it but for all the rest, for sure.
I see AM in the same way I see rallying cry for Warrior.
Remove seasons.
I wish Ashen Hallow could’ve been an option as a replacement for Consecration but it’s gone now.
yes but your using another defensive to supplement sac while prot can just do it without a thought
i mean, why are we pretending that avenging shield doesnt silence its main target as well. its another rupt on a short cd that can be reset along side their regular rupt. they also have access to dt dr and blinding light.
im not saying that, im saying devo aura is interchangeable between all 3 specs, but you lose less with prot and ho.ly cause they have extra utility ontop of the shared paladin utility,
i mean, then you have to give hpal something that other healers have to. you open a huge can of worms with healing cds
thats not fixing the problem, thats making sac into a dps cd and encouraging your to use it on cd for a dps increase. instead of using it as utility. recompense is also a meme cause it shares a node with 1min sac.
its easy to say theres plenty of things to be done. but like when you boil down each idea it kinda gets weird and kinda sucky. the general consensus is probably make all 3 specs share the unique utility with ret. so you dont feel the need to stack more than one of a class for mandatory utility.
we also have to be realistic, ashen hollow is just not coming back, theres a list of coven abilities that wont come back due to their power or lack of notability. ashen hollow is in that list along side the hunter nightfae ability
Really happy about the Holy Prism buff, actually. Our Dragonflight set bonus that did the same thing felt really, really good, and made Holy Prism into an extremely valuable and impactful tool in our healing kit.
Prism has been pretty great in TWW too, what with the Divine Favor talent and the Dawnlight synergies from Herald, but this buff by itself is going to just make the spell feel so good to cast.
I personally would’ve like to see a bigger damage buff. Think we could’ve had like a 10% across the board, or like 75% consercration buff. Healing will be much more comfortable though honestly, and should have more holy power to SOTR for like 50k lmao
This is quite true. Personally, I wouldnt like consecration to be buffed but more like a flat % aura buff + greater buffs to our active damage (a.k.a holy shock too). Specially now that LS is algo gutted.
However, other than pre nerf version of Mw, no other healer is realistically doing enough damage to even matter in 95% of all content except maybe high end raid/m+
the only damage profile ret isn’t great at is straight single target and high priority funnel. the latter is why they’re not part of the top key groups, but they are amazing at any and every pug m+ damage profile with their extreme sustained AOE and quick cool downs. Go into any +12-14 pug right now and ret tops overall. It’s a good time to be ret in keys.
Not sure why this is a problem. Prot is a tank spec and will inherently handle the downsides of Sac better.
Holy has the same issue as Ret; using Sac can get you killed if you’re unlucky or use it at the wrong time. Using sac and dropping from 100% to 30% is a common occurrence.
yes, but holy has other things that ret doesnt have. thats the point. prot can handle the thing ret have but better. so end of the day the only thing ret brings is damage not some unique utility.
Ok… and? How is that any different from any other class?
The deciding factor for ret will always be a combination of its utility and damage. No one is bringing a holy paladin over ret because they have blessing of seasons.
Ret could have all the utility that holy/prot have but wouldn’t be taken if the damage wasn’t competitive. Ret also has way more utility than some other DPS specs in the game.
idk it just kinda sucks when your 2 sister specs bring more to the table than you do utility wise.
if i cared about the utility of other specs, i would mention them. rn im just strictly talking ret paladin. i am aware that ret brings more than other dps specs. i just think that all 3 paladins should share their utility like they always have, so it ends up being outside factors to decide whether or not they are taken like damage and how they heal compared to other dps/healers/tanks
But that’s what is happening? Holy paladin wasn’t taken in the RWF because it’s healing and damage suck compared to other healers. It had nothing to do with Paladin utility.