It’s any good ?
If it was Mass Regen I would have jumped on it but loosing either 15% crit or FoF for a single target heal that’s reduced by 50% on ourselves doesn’t look that big.
Mass Regen isnt great anyways because your party ends up all over the place. And channeled heals are not reduced by the 50% the same way beacon healing is
If you want to gimp yourself in PvP by getting a 4pc PvE bonus and losing over 1000 HP, sure
I dont feel gimped at all and it provides faster heals than CSP from constantly tossing out Barrage.
BUFF MAGE PVP Damage!!!
Its an absolute joke that beacon healing is nerfed in pvp like other heals, but its based on damage that is already 40% nerfed. double dipped nerf to mage healing outside of CSP.
So besides the fact that we have long casted nukes with little-no pushback protection and 30yd range…
When you actually have beacons up and get a nuke off - its hitting for 60% thanks to pvp spell damage nerfs, beacon only heals for 80% in the first place (so now were down to healing for 50% of what our real damage would have been), and THEN the pvp healing reduction cuts that down. Winding up with like 25% of what we should be healing for. or 12.5% to ourselves.
2 Likes
how to fix mage in pvp 101:
(EDIT: Added reduced CD on Cold Snap, and replaced Molten armor (now base) with Slow)
PvP specific modifier: healing from Regen/Mass regen beacons no longer subject to PvP healing reduction as they are already based on 40% reduced spell damage modifier in PvP.
Talent Fixes:
Arcane Subtlety - Now pierces 30/60 all resist (up from 5/10)
Magic Attunement - Now increases Arcane Blast, Barrage, Missiles, and Surge range by 3/6 yds.
Improved Fireball - Now includes FFB and BFB
Improved Frostbolt - Now includes FFB, SFB, and BFB (potentially not stacking with imp FB, but really for 10 talent points to get 2 second FFB i believe its fine stacking, and BFB has a 4 cast limit so cant really spam it anyway).
Arctic Reach - Now also increases SFB and Ice Lance range by 10/20%
Piercing Ice - 35/70% pushback protection for frost spells
Cold Snap - Reduced to 5 min CD
Ice Barrier - 100% SP scaling
Rune Fixes :
Chest:
Regeneration - is now baseline ability(having this compete with crit talents makes it unusable for any dps setup, and mage healers need the help that the extra crit would bring.)
Enlightenment - while between 30-70% mana gives 10% spell haste, under 30% mana is now 1% mana per second regeneration.
Helm:
Deep Freeze - is no longer on the GCD and cannot be resisted. (zugger orcs)
Waist:
Missile Barrage - can now be trigged at 25-40% rate by BFB (arcane spell).
Legs:
Living Flame - move speed reverted to pre-nerf.
Arcane Surge - is no longer on the GCD.
Mass Regen - beacon duration increased to 21s.
Feet:
Spell Power - Removed, 50% fire critical damage added to Fire Power Talent, 50% Arcane critical damage added to Arcane Instability talent (these are the 25 point talents so they are not possible to stack)
Wrist:
Rewind Time - no longer reduced healing in pvp.
Displacement - off GCD and now costs 0 mana.
Molten Armor - Moved to base class ability (it competes with baseline abilities, similar to paladins now baseline Horn vs BoM), replaced with NEW Slow
Hands:
Ice Lance - now has 25-35% SP scaling
Living Bomb - ticks comparatively to moonfire/sunfire
Arcane Blast - 5% haste on Arcane Blast per stack until stacks consumed
2 Likes
I would add slow to arcane barrage.
2 Likes
good thread, i really believe alot of balance could be arranged if they just stopped being lazy and do individual pvp tuning for classes.
4 Likes
most of this is exactly what i´ve been saying too. this is pretty much spot on. ice lance 30% sp increase in full pvp gear is about 100 added damage so it should be higher. displacement off gcd can make you blink 3 times in a split second, that shouldn´t be a thing imo. all the talent changes were spot on, especially arcane range increase and frost pushback AND regeneration baseline. good on you, sir.
people need to see this list of changes
4 Likes
Agree here. Outside of that, I like the other changes. I have no issues with the 3 blinks, because we are supposed to be glass cannons. Most classes that easily kill mages already have more mobility than they ever did in Vanilla, so us having that much mobility isn’t really an issue. If they touch us, we die pretty easily tbf.
Ice Lance really needs like a 100% spell power increase. It’s only useful if we have a freeze effect on the target. Frost Nova is a 25 second CD. If we choose to reset it with CS we lose out on a 2nd IV or IB, and that’s a 10 minute CD. FOrb is a 45 second CD, and only gets down to 35 seconds if you’re wearing ZG tier, which I would argue most mages wouldn’t gimp themselves with PvE gear if they would just fix our damage to begin with.
FFB/SFB/BFB faster casts would make the low damage more tolerable than it is, but it still needs a damage buff. Casting is hard in SoD when everyone has mobility and interrupts. Most classes have instant abilities (melee/other casters) that do more damage on a crit than ANY OF THE THREE we’re talking about here. This also doesn’t address or fix the mana per damage issue. Even with faster casts, if we aren’t doing enough damage to actually kill someone we will still go OOM before they die which is why damage needs buffed on our hard casts.
Living Flame 100% needs the travel speed reverted, OR if they don’t want to revert the travel speed when casted it should start on the target instead of traveling to it.
Living Bomb 100% should tick as hard as Boomie DoTs do if they aren’t going to buff its explosion damage. At the moment, mages only really use Living Bomb in PvP for the chance on proc’ing Hot Streaks for instant Pyros.
We currently cannot live up to the class fantasy of a glass cannon when we are made of glass but have no cannon behind it.
All of the other changes he outlined I think are a wonderful idea and not something I even considered.
1 Like
Correction: No dots should tick as hard as Boomie DoTs; especially if they’ve got the potential to crit.
Elsewise just delete every warrior who’s playing the game currently.
Well excuse me Mr. Judge Judy and Executioner. I wasn’t aware I was talking to the king.
My apologies my liege. You’re right, we should ensure unmitigatable magical damage drops people in the space of a global instead of having an appropriate TTK in PvP to allow for all classes to play the game they pay for.
My mistake. Thanks for the correction.
The DoTs themselves don’t give Hot Streak. The explosions at the end do.
If you don’t want the DoT to tick hard, then the explosion needs to do current FFB numbers and explode for over 1k.
Blink is still on the GCD so you wont see 3 blinks instant. ANd even if you did, you’d burn all your mobility in a sec and get yourself completely open. Either blink or displacement should be off GCD since Shadowstep is.
2 Likes
Fair point - my question on this is in what order is the damage calculation done?
My assumption was that the SP was calculated on the base damage of the hit (say for example its currently hitting for 100 with no frozen, no crit )
In that example, adding another 100 from 30% SP essentially doubles the final damage.
instead of 100x3(frozen)x2(crit) = 600, you would now hit for ~ 1200 with the same frozen+crit. This could scale pretty quickly with PVE gear/Flask/higher SP stats in next phase etc so i was trying to be careful.
I may be off on the order of operations in which SP is calculated, if so then yes it would need to be higher.
I also added reduced CD on Cold Snap, and replaced Molten Armor rune with Slow on bracer slot, as Molten should be a base ability not a rune.
1 Like
LB is a rune, physically taking up a rune slot. It currently does laughable damage. Either the DoT needs to be buffed, or the explosion needs to be buffed. I can agree it should not get both. If we buff the explosion, it needs to hit for something and matter. Current FFB hits for about 750-900 non-crit. Making our 1 controllable and dispellable DoT tick as hard as a single Boomie DoT does is not equivalent to the damage that a Boomie with all DoTs up does… Mages aren’t going to melt warriors from 1 DoT getting a well-deserved buff.
Your sarcasm, hyperbole, and room temp IQ takes aren’t wanted here. They aren’t helpful, and they don’t add anything to the discussion. I imagine there’s a reason you choose not to post on your SoD main.
Or, dude, we can turn the knob down a tad on balance druid damage to be better in line with the mage, and we won’t have to worry about an additional class doing game-breaking amounts of damage.
I know reading isn’t your strong suit, but I’ll re-cap for you:
Mage’s ONE controllable DoT that can be easily dispelled does laughable damage as it currently is. Buffing it to do the same damage as ONE Boomie DoT IS NOT EQUAL TO all 3-4 of a Boomie’s DoTs in damage and will not make Mages as busted as Boomies currently are.
Now please, go elsewhere. No one here cares to hear any more from you unless you’re going to add something constructive and helpful.
Bumping for the copium
1 Like
Mage is in a poor spot in general, PVE and PVP.