Mage is in a BAD spot in PvP for SoD

WoW Classic Season of Discovery
1

Can you please address mages in PvP? It’s been asked before and seems to fall on deaf ears. Mage is quite literally the worst caster in the game for any spec when it comes to PvP. Our strongest damage ability is between two 3 second casts (FFB/BFB), and both of them do less damage than a Hunter’s autoshot, even with crit. Not to mention casters aren’t even casting in SoD because its nearly impossible to get long casts off to do damage.

IDK if there’s even a point in me making this thread. Hopefully someone agrees and this gets some traction. PvP, regardless of how many buffs you give to honor gain, is not fun at the moment because some classes just feel like absolute dog turds while others feel like they’re cheating with how strong they are.

Not trying to dog on Blizz here, but how can they expect us to feel confident in their ability to do Classic+ correctly when SoD has been such a mess on a huge pillar of the game for classic (PvP). PvP in classic wasn’t perfectly balanced, and I get that. I’m not asking for a perfect balance, I’m asking for the devs to do a bit more tuning rather than a hands-off blanket approach which only sees the strong classes get stronger and the weaker classes get weaker.

EDITING TO PASTE A COMMENT SO IT’S AT THE TOP AND EASY FOR THE DEVS TO READ

Truly a sad state of affairs.

Mage PvP buffs literally wouldn’t even require much dev time.

They just need to buff the mage’s damage abilities by x% and that can be ramped up slowly to make sure it isn’t over-buffed.

They can absolutely make it a PvP only buff because the engine is built off of the 2016 Legion engine, not the OG classic engine. That prevents mages from getting too strong in PvE content, but also gives us a buff to our dps abilities in PvP.

When Mage only has 2-3 instant cast buttons compared to most other classes do little to no damage it is a problem. Our casted buttons like Frostbolt, Frostfire Bolt, Fireball, and Spellfrost Bolt do less damage than many other classes auto-attacks. Right now with the stamina buffs and full PvP gear most classes have between 7000-15000 HP with some being even higher when they use full consumes. If my 3 second cast does less than 20% of someone’s health bar then it pretty much makes the ability pointless. If I can get a 2.5 to 3 second cast off on someone in a fight it should be rewarding. It should do a lot of damage.

The main abilities that NEED a buff are as follows:

- Ice Barrier
(This capstone talent for frost is a joke atm and only shields for like 800 dmg. When auto attacks are doing over the amount that the barrier shields for it is obvious that it’s too weak - especially with a 30 second CD.)

- Ice Lance
(Only spell in the entire game that doesn’t scale with spell power, and it’s the main dmg ability for mages when we use Frozen Orb to eat our Fingers of Frost procs. This ability at minimum needs to be taken off of the GCD. It currently hits for about 600-700 damage, and only hits that hard IF you have a Fingers of Frost proc. When you don’t have a proc it hits for like 120 damage lol.)

- Frostbolt
(Scaled super low, and the blanket spell damage nerf they put in hurts it even worse. Shatters don’t feel good or satisfying to use this button on. Hits for negligible damage. It’s a 2.5 second cast that when talented currently hits for 650-900 damage on average, even with a shatter.)

- Frostfire Bolt
(Just as bad as Frostbolt when it comes to scaling in PvP. We are lucky when we get a 1500 as a crit from Shatter. Most of the time it hits for between 700-900. For a 3 second cast this is unacceptable – If I get a full 3 second cast off in a fight it should be rewarding for me and do a lot of damage.)

- Scorch
(Again, same problem as the others. Short cast time, so it shouldn’t do as much damage as a Frostbolt or FFB, but it certainly shouldn’t only hit for 150-200 dmg. Dot ticks do more damage than this cast does.)

- Cone of Cold
(And another with the same issue. Scaling too low. This doesn’t need AS BIG of a buff, but it should still hit harder than it does. Sometimes you can get a shatter crit for 800-900 if you get really lucky.)

I think starting with a blanket 10-15% buff on ALL mage DPS abilities would be a good start. Then they could adjust from there to see where the chips fall, whether they need to up it a bit more or lower it if it scales too hard with crit (even though I doubt it would).

I keep hoping that as people comment on this post it will get some sort of attention. Everyone on the forums is in agreement that Mages need help when it comes to PvP and that we are at the absolute bottom of the totem pole compared to everyone. Our damage is negligible, and our healing spec that they designed specifically for SoD has so many problems with being clunky on top of the main buff for said healing being dispellable.

I would appreciate it if everyone would keep talking about this, and responding to this post. If we keep it near the top and get enough engagement it could possibly force their hand to at least look at the class at minimum.

20 Likes
2

I agree, also people in MC gear with Fire Resistance doesn’t help us at all either.
I feel like I’m hitting people with a wet pool noodle while hunters and warriors are just demolishing everything

3 Likes
3

It may be time for us to all play melee oh and boomy/hunter.

3 Likes
4

id like to see range increase on cast time abilities so at least mages can sit back and howitzer

4 Likes
5

100% agree, especially about the damage for a 3 sec cast vs insta cast for other classes. Hell even our cheesy CC has a ridiculously long cast vs others, at the very least it should stun when it breaks…

But they won’t listen dude, just join me and play New World re release on the Oct 15. Casters actually can get stuff off there and the pvp is based on skill not what Dev loves what class.

Or you can go try Thrones of Liberty as well. These Devs have shown they are lazy, clueless and our pretty much incapable of producing content for a AAA MMO. It’s no wonder why Microsoft has been cutting jobs and trimming the fat off of this company they just acquired.

3 Likes
6

Howitzer?? Hunter’s and Boomie have insta cast abilities that hit harder than all of our abilities. And their range is nuts!

Starsurge, Starfall and Chimera Shot destroy anything we have and their insta cast.

Shamans dot on flame shock will take you to half life and they can hit 5 people at a freaking time with it. Then the proc comes and finishes you off.

Every single one of them is 200 times more tanky the we are. If we are glass at least we should be the cannons but we are more like glass bb guns.

4 Likes
7

BFB and Pyro would be more viable at 40yards, arcane healing would be much more viable if you didnt have to be in insta gib range. forcing the opponent to go through your teammates changes the dynamics of pvp. if you’re talking 1v1 thats not really an issue that should be addressed. some classes are supposed to be and are better 1v1 and some are better in team fights. mage excels at neither which is the problem. also, counter classes are a thing for everyone generally. frost v melee and 3 minute mage would be your 1v1 specs.

shamans dot doesnt do anything when you use your advance warding rune to dispel it. thats bad play on your part if you arent dispelling it

of whom you listed only the shaman is more tanky. but yes that’s why i suggested mages should get increased range on their casts. @40 yards base talented your fire spells would be 46 yards which puts your out of range of most classes for free damage.

3 Likes
8

I tried for literally months to explain Mage was falling off and the Devs DO NOT CARE. Just go to retail, cata, or Era to enjoy your PvP. SoD is Doomed.

2 Likes
10

that last part 100%

Wanna hear a fun fact? my 3 second cast for Frostfire Bolt in PvP crits top end for like 1100 which is less than a hunter’s auto-shot. That’s counting the Brainfreeze buff in on it, along with the FoF rune.

Fun times. I think other’s are right though. Blizz literally doesn’t care about SoD PvP. It sucks because PvP is a pillar for classic wow, even though it was unbalanced then too. How are we supposed to believe in them and have confidence they can do Classic + correctly when they won’t even address legitimate concerns in this “beta”?

3 Likes
11

You’re playing mage wrong in BGs if you’re trying to do damage lol. We’re healers now dude.

2 Likes
12

My exact point made.

Thanks!

13

Yeah this is it. We’re just healers now. Pretty good sometimes if there’s not a lot of rogues out there.

14

mage healing would be literally the WORST healing in pvp. every single one of your heals are casted or channeled meaning youre the first person who is going to get counterspelled, interrupted, silenced, etc. rendering you completely useless. every other healing class has instant cast spells they can work around to avoid things like this.

3 Likes
16

Still waiting on some sort of buff for Mage DPS for PvP. This is horrendous. We are the absolute worst class in the game for a dps of all 3 specs.

17

It feels really bad hard casting FFB and dealing 500-600 damage. Pretty sure moonkin crit dots tick hit for around 500-600 damage lol. Let that sink in.

We need some sort of threatening damage. I think a major buff to ice lance could help bring us in line with other casters. Allow ice lance to hit hard, it’s a situational ability after all. It requires either set up, or a Fof proc. I think it’s a change that would benefit frost Pve as well.

1 Like
18

I’d be perfectly fine with that… I wouldn’t complain if we became 45 second mages depending on Frozen Orb for Ice Lance procs/BF FFB’s and didnt really do much outside of that. I don’t mind having to set up the damage at all. I just cannot stand that one of the PREMIER pvp classes/specs in regular vanilla is the absolute biggest piece of crap in PvP in this beta of Classic+ and that the devs literally don’t care.

People won’t PvP when their class feels like absolute crap, regardless of the rewards. I have now went through 4 phases, each time saying “THIS TIME they’ll actually make some changes and help us out” and every time has been pure copium. Mage PvP is being pigeon-holed into being a sub-par healer, and I would almost guarantee 99.9% of all people who rolled a mage with intentions to PvP did NOT do so to play a healer.

19

Go arcane, had a couple mages surge me and pyro and i was dead

20

We weren’t a premier class. It was all rock paper scissors.

21

I mean, I guess one can do that, but then you’re just a 3 minute class without CC lol

1 Like
22

Yeah… the reason why mages suck at pvp is because of the 40% dmg nerf. Hmm maybe if blizzard were to nerf the damage a class does in pvp instead of the type of damage. 40% nerf makes sense for casters such as SP and boomie since their dots do so much dmg. But for BFB or FFB/Pyro? 40% is too much. It crits for maybe 25% of someones hp.

Meanwhile a hunter from 40 yards away can kill you in 2 globals when you are in full pvp gear and through an ice barrier, both of which are instant cast and uninterruptable.

3 Likes