Yes, stab raiding directly in the throat.
Iām well aware of what they are and wereā¦ My point is that azerite traits are better as a whole and let you make your own set bonuses. Maybe I want to do AoE, maybe I want to do single target, maybe I want movement speed instead of a shield, etc etc. With fixed set bonuses, you donāt get that flexibility. I hope they put something similar into Shadowlands.
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Gonna say no. M+ is one of the only reasons Iām playing right now. Itās a great way to get some higher end gear without the time commitment of raiding.
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Yeah, instead you have to maintain the best traits for your role, and change traits if you lose one due to a gear upgrade.
We had that before, with reforging. Lost some haste you needed? Hit the reforger and get it on a different piece of gear.
Wait, did I just have another fever-dreamā¦?
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I was JUST having this discussion with my brother in law last night. There are only two possible funnels for gear for me having just come back a month ago. Mythics, or weekly rng. Thatās it.
Too low a gear score to raid, and only one possible progression path that isnāt a weekly rng. To make matters worse, I depend entirely on a group thatās just tired of waiting and will take me as a quick fill, or I need people to spend a half hour of their time EACH to carry me through some keys, and that just doesnāt feel good man. That being said, Iām not overly concerned about it. Iām quite enjoying the questing content. I totally see where they were going with making mythics relevant, but I donāt think this system hit the mark.
Used to be reps, or tokens you could brute force your way around gearing slumps, but so far, I see none of that except MAYBE benthics, which, I only found out about last night, but something tells me there is a hard cap on those mana perl things, if not only a singular benthic you can upgrade. Not sure yet, but we will see!
Probably will see more, yeah. Although looking at Keystone Conqueror itās only 7% for season 3.
More than twice as many as Keystone Master but still fewer than one in ten people.
Really the only point Iām getting at is mythic+ isnāt a Mythic Raid-equivalent loot piƱata for most people.
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I dont have access to a raid team currently the server is dead and the guilds are only recruiting 460+ for heroicā¦
so Iām currently doing pug keys and most of the time suffering what it comes with that and hoping for the bestā¦ some normal nya as well but nothing big since pugs usually donāt get too farā¦
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Welcome to World of Diablocraft! The people that defend M+ should just go and play another genre and stop praising a system that completely sucks for a casual MMO.
IB4 āBut you donāt have to run M+ā WRONG!!! It is part of the gearing ladder now, it is basically required content for competitive players that enjoy just raiding or PVP.
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Go play Diablo then or one of the 100 other amazing ARPGs. Iām sick of players defending M+, it donāt belong in a MMO.
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Sounds like a great idea. If you wanted to increase the amount of leavers you run into. The number one reason people leave mythic+ keys? Lack of reward at the end. Chances are theyāre just there for their raider IO profile, and as soon as the key looks like itās a fail they bail.
BIS items still come from the raid. Azerite gear, weapons, trinkets are still bis from mythic raiding. A person in full mythic bis gear will outperform another class in full bis mythic plus gear all the time given they have the same skill level.
So I do not see the problem here.
K, and I leave game. I donāt raid, donāt care about raiding, havenāt for a long time. So you have to do something to keep me in the game. M+ does it. Raiding is a relic of old wow, it is time to move past it.
Maybe the solution is to allow M+ gear to outpace raid as you approach M30? I mean peeps finish beating raids pretty quick now, but M+ has more legs 
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mys suggestion then is to have mythic + gear remain as is and able to scale the same way it does so far.
But Raid gear needs to be like the Benthic gear. they have bonus effects making it better to have the 475 Raid gear vs the 475 M+ gear. maybe even add a side effect saying the effect is increased by 1% for every other item you have from the raid.
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Please explain how that would āstab raiding in the throatā
Given the freedom that comes from do when you want 5 man content? Why would I bother raiding if I enjoy m+?
If 5 man gear didnāt work in a raid, raiding seems like a huge waste of time.
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I dont think youre making the point you want to be making.
Many complain about how mythic + invalidates raiding because you can easily outgear raids with only dungeon gear.
If you dont want to raid then dont. And then people who dont want to do mythic+ but like to raid, can just raid without feeling like they are falling behind with the lack of m+ gear.
Do you think raid participation would go up or down with your system? My money is on way down.
I raid, now, and my only reward chance is a good corruption. If my gear didnāt work I would never go back.
It has already largely been addressed by the way. M+ gear has a garbage chance to corrupt.
Probably up, since so many of the quitting players and guilds have done so because raiding feels non rewarding because they have better gear from m+.
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Gear progression is the number one driver for any MMO. Right now we have three basic end-gamesā¦ actually 4!
Pvp
M+
Raiding
(Visions)
They all use the same stuff alsoā¦ I think that having gear that helps you out in special ways for certain areas of the game is nice.
Resilience?
Maybe speed boosting?
Set bonus for non Azerite gear?
Corruption?
We have corruption and it is really made for visions and just gets carried over into the other three. (Unbalanced) except Nyāalotha but going back to any other raid becomes a joke.
Iām actually looking forward to the more solo methods for gear like in Shadowlands since I donāt play as hardcore as I once did.
This isnāt true for anything besides select trinkets, since they removed tier sets.
you can, with risiduumā¦? Unless you raid Mythic youāll be getting all your Azerite that way since itās higher ilvl, and even if you do raid Mythic youāll probably buy at least a couple risiduum Azerite before youāve got 3 pieces from the raid.