M+ does not feel good to a majority of players - Thoughts?

It’s just on week 3. Many has gotten KSM already.

We got welfare Delve loots to face M+. Looks okay to me.

But I know, newcomers would have a hard time. But as positive, they get welfare Delve loots too to beat M0 where they should start. If they went straight to M+4 and they are newcomers who hasnt done M+ before, expect them to get Wrecked too.

yeah, so smooth that no one learned the mechanics. they would move up just from out gearing the lower keys.

They shouldn’t, they should fix their class imbalance. But they’re either incapable of doing so, or not interested in doing so - both are huge problems.

A big add fight like Ovi’nax, for example, is “how many Fury Warriors and DPS DK’s can you bring?” And it’s a totally different fight between “five” and “none”.

Not to mention the grip disparity. It’s Yet Another Raid Tier where Blood DK is required.

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I’m really not seeing anything that doesn’t gel with exactly what the dude you replied to said, lol.

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I’m not, and you saying this means that you don’t get what I said at all. What I’m saying is this: people who are good and push really hard, don’t need to have ANY Mythic gear to start killing Mythic bosses in a rush and race to get the world first kill as soon as possible.

People like Brewa doesn’t have that requirement, at all.
They can, if they want to, take their time and get Mythic gear from raiding and rely on nothing other than Heroic gear and more Mythic gear than those who participated in RWF. Adding M+ to this just makes it go faster, it is by ZERO measurements a requirement to kill Mythic bosses - that’s what TWW’s RWF proved.


We have proof that this idea of “M+ is required for Mythic raiding” is categorically false. All M+ does is speed it up, and it ain’t a requirement.

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I guess you know better than the devs on this one.

Funny, I don’t recall ever saying that I did, only that what you described and apparently took umbrage with was a smooth difficulty curve.

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You know, something that has always irked me, the term “welfare” gear. Blizz is not giving these players free game time and free gear in their mailbox just cause they cannot afford them or are unable to work for them. Call it lowbie gear, call it simple gear, heck call it what every piece of gear in this game eventually becomes… irrelevant gear. But people need to stop using this term. As someone who spends money like its just been printed, I spend close to $150 a month on this game and even I find that term unsettling.

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Every person on this Forum is guilty of this one. Let me help you down off that horse. Don’t want to dent your gear.

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I don’t think the term is meant to be accurate, only derogatory.
Whether to the system or the players that of it partake, that’s to be determined on a case-by-case basis.

I think the changes were good. People are just sad that they can’t faceroll low keys for amazing gear.

Which makes it worse. It’s akin to calling it ghetto gear, or something even more demeaning.

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I like this one a lot more honestly, lol.

That’s not what welfare gear means; welfare gear means gear that is disproportionately too good for the (lack of) challenge involved.

The first use was in Burning Crusade, when you would get Tier 5 equivalent gear for losing 10 arena games a week.

The changes were fine. The problem is their M+ score got wrecked when they took the easier and faster route to better early gear. If they had ignored Delves and stuck to “M0”, this thread, and 3 dozen others would not exist.

ROFL, delve gear? Are you serious with this?

Reddit is literally just a place people go complain about everything 24/7.

My opinion… yeah the start of the M+ season was ROUGH.

But they’ve nerfed some of the really brutal bosses and now that people are actually learning to… heaven forbid… do the mechanics properly, I’ve found it to be pretty enjoyable.

Except Grim Batol… ugh.

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I do not disagree. When it was created, the world was a different place. We need to change our terms to prove we can grow with an ever changing world. I personally am not offended, but using socially descriptive terms to describe things in this game just makes people sound like the people they are not… I said something similar about calling the game cancer. We need to be better and find new ways to describe it. Maybe Lose-to-Win gear. Who knows.

Back in the 70’s we called it Monty Haul gear, a term I still use with some regularity. But it’s an expression that’s lost on most kids.

Early Delve gear vs early M0 gear. In the past it went Normal > Heroics > M0/M+

Now, Delves (which are ridiculously easy and infinite to farm) make Low M gear useless. So those who want the edge chase the gear in the Delves instead of M0-M10 to get their rating up with subpar gear. Fast tracking the gear in Delves means losing out on the Season Rating unless you go back and take the time to be overgeared in what would now be subpar content. End Gamers hate “wasting time” so having to go back and boost their rating on boring levels is a waste of time for them.