I wouldn’t say people are too lazy to learn M+. People pay to play a game to relax. People play a mmorpg to have that progression feel. The devs havent learned from their mistakes at all. The biggest complaint about shadowlands is game friction. All they did was hide the friction in the guise of making the game more challenging. I dont mind content bring challenging but the standard game UI doesnt give you the tools you need to learn to improve in M+. There’s way too many mechanics to track on top of trying to keep a rotation making the game enjoyable only to spreadsheet enthusiasts and stamp collectors.
22 Likes
You say this, but then the rest of your post suggests that people are simply too lazy to learn.
15 Likes
Some people play an MMO for Prgression, others to simply play with friends in a huge environment. Some people play an MMO-RPG for the story, and to play with others. MMOs are not exclusively about progression. The main purpose of any RPG is right in its description:
A role-playing game (RPG) is a game in which each participant assumes the role of a character that can interact within the game’s imaginary world.
How we interact with that environment is completely subjective and personal at the hands of the player. Some people are solely in it for progression, to be the top dog, and have “bragging rights” with others who are also competitive. Some just want to experience the story and the lore without the need for a “challenge” and are content capping at a semi-heroic level. They just don’t want to miss key elements in the campaign itself. The last group simply logs in, experiences the game, and then finds like minded players to simply roleplay D&D style with their guild and others like them in the open world, or in instanced content.
The biggest complaint I had about SL was the lack of flying in the Maw, and the constant combat when simply trying to go hit an objective before you could use the item in your bag to return to Ven’ari.
As for M+, if you have DBM and MDT installed, start at M0, and work your way up, you learn everything you need to know. IO has 72 pages of teams pushing 12+ keys and they are not here telling Blizz what they did wrong. They worked their way up, did NOT pug, and use voice chat to work through it. The whole purpose of M+ is to get people into guilds to use voice chat and work together.
The game is finally being presented as the solo adventure it always should have been, and there is tons of stuff for us casuals who are not interested in M+ or M-Raids. We want to log in, enjoy the story, experience the Lore, collect some pets and mounts, run the old content we never got to see when it was current, and enjoy our long list of available activities.
People are not too lazy to learn M+. They are just not bright enough to know pugging is what is frustrating them. Those enjoying it the most, even when they brick a key, are friends in Discord, and I watch it every night with 4 or 5 different streamers who have fun, communicate, fill in one open spot with a rando, and then start the run.
Be part of the solution. You can do it.
7 Likes
I can do both, hell most of my friends laugh at me because they say i like to farm with my gathering professions instead of just making gold fliping the AH with the TSM addon. I do it because i love to put music behind and farm, is really relaxing and also do World Quest meanwhile.
But when i want some challenge i try to push keys, to push my score. You can do BOTH, but if M+ is stressing you then just quit it and do what relaxes you.
3 Likes
It’s not lazy to not want to subject yourself to endless third-party website write-ups and YouTube videos because Blizzard is incapable of designing their game to be more intuitive lol
16 Likes
OP is complaining about class rotations and the complexity of M+ mechanics. You don’t need third party anything to figure out either one of those. Those make it easier, but they’re far from necessary.
You figure out your class by reading tooltips and playing it. By the time you get to M+ you should already know your spec. You figure out dungeon mechanics by reading the dungeon journal and doing the fights. Difficulty progression is still there so you can and should start in M0 to learn the mechanics for M+ without the added stress of affixes and scaling.
That’s information that is 100% available in the stock UI. Players just don’t want to learn on their own, they would rather be told what to do.
Yes, Blizzard could stop trying to make certain things overly complicated or obfuscated, but I don’t think that applies to what OP is fussing about. Their complaint really does boil down to most players being lazy.
1 Like
This is completely dependent on the class we’re discussing. If you’re playing an arcane mage, you’re going to have to look up guides and YouTube videos to better understand what spell clipping and queueing are, because not knowing how to do either of those things (and do them effectively) is akin to handicapping your own DPS.
Same for enhancement shaman, which has a plethora of builds and spells that aren’t conducive to a self-learning environment. The problem is that, more often than not, classes have something about them that require additional resources than the ones given to you in-game.
6 Likes
We must be playing different games.
i like mythic + or the idea of it at least because everything is so easy. Mobs are no real threat, raids are fun but kind of mindless after awhile. Mythics are the only real place it feels where you need to actually know how to play your class and your actions or inactions have consequences
1 Like
If you don’t want to spend time learning M+, don’t do M+.
You are conflating min-maxing with playing at a competent level. The game gives you more than enough information to learn to be competent at your class, and simply being competent is enough to clear all but the most bleeding edge of content.
4 Likes
Spell clipping and queueing is not min-maxing. It’s a core part of the arcane mage rotation. If you’re not doing either of those things, you’re not participating in endgame content lol
5 Likes
There are loads of mechanics in M+ that are not explained or obvious. Those things should be removed or made obvious.
Examples. Stonevault first boss tank mexhanic that is actually a healer mechanic.
CoT 2nd boss. Group soak with tank that looks like a thing you should run from. Later in that same dungeon there is a similar circle put on the tank that you must run from.
The way scaling works many of these abilities jump from doing little to instant death. Then there is that wonderful timer on low keys that makes explaining anything impossible because there is no time for that.
Must be different games. Cause if I muck my rotation while fighting:
- World Bosses
- Normal dungeons
- LFR
- Rares
- World PvP (not that I do it anymore)
then I am hosed. Rotations and mechanics are not exclusive to M+. Affixes and Timers are exclusive to M+. People can still die fighting a murloc if they don’t know what they are doing.
1 Like
Maybe if your a Druid
/s
1 Like
M+ has some of the most vile and toxic players in this community outside of Rated PvP (and even then some of them are way nicer) why would anyone new commit to learning and playing them unless they have a full group of friends?
7 Likes
Bout spit that coffee 
and TBF, the first time Murlocs bum rolled me, I was a level 9 hunter.
2 Likes
I really do like the idea mythic+ provides but I don’t do them outside of a rare guild run solely off of the reputation they have
1 Like
what is to learn in M+? a M0 will teach u all the boss mechanics , M+2 doesnt add anything but Xala affix , so a good way to learn it
after that is just tyra-Fort buffs and more death penalty…
1 Like
those players seem to be too high up the progression curve then. Normal, heroic, mythic exist for them.
Fun part is going into a stranger’s key as a 4-stack. Being in voice. Not using voice to coordinate anything and just blasting with a default UI while the guy we joined the group of complains that we were in voice as the reason why he wasn’t using his kick. I think the only coordination we had was “Oops, I fatfingered lust, hit drums next boss.”
People tend to over-complicate things and think it is some secret UI that makes people better, or an add-on, or constant voice-coms but… You don’t need any of them to do 99% of keys. You just need spatial awareness, game knowledge and class knowledge. Interrupt, if interrupts aren’t available and don’t seem to be going out, toss out a defensive if the mobs are targeting you and pray the other person has the awareness to do so if it is targeting them.
2 Likes