"Looking For Raid isn't raiding."

BFA cape you could do completely solo. I did it in groups because I found visions more fun, but you could definitely do them solo without issue

alright homework time: Emerald Dream, Nighthold, Antorus the Burning Throne,
Battle for Dazar’alor, Azshara’s Eternal Palace, and Castle Nathria

LFR is the only raiding that really takes skill; I refuse to do normal, heroic, or mythic because you can cheat by choosing to play with good people

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I probably would have done visions, but I didn’t have any money during that time and I was working 40 hours a week. I realize a lot of people work and play WoW, but I simply couldn’t manage. 8 hour shifts ruin me completely. I stayed subscribed, but I didn’t get much playing done in Legion or BfA. I did the outdoor quests and unlocked the races, but I just didn’t have the stamina to do the stuff I normally did.

I got the Underlight Angler and did all that, but I didn’t do much Archaeology in either expansion and still need to catch up.

Luckily, I don’t ever have to work again, so I’m ready to let the good times roll. :beers:

I wish I could :heart: this more than once.

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LFR requires both tanks, three healers and eight± DPS to be awake and competent.
The rest can probably go for a snooze somewhere.

To me the mindset still applies. I don’t look at normal/heroic dungeon people (or even low level key runners) with this “well that should be removed. We don’t need heroic dungeons just normal and mythic amirite?” mentality.

tutorial mode. sightseeing mode. etc

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Same reason a catfish isn’t a cat.

Oh god the maze phase .

THat is when determination was added to lfr

lfr is raiding, but its really really bad raiding. Its biggest detriments are having no fail state, and the quality of the kind of players who only raid lfr. Its fine for it to exist, but I do pity players who only lfr and think they have experienced what raiding is really about.

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It was only hard because people didnt know the basic mechanics.
it wasnt hard. it was tourist mode. LFR folks just couldnt handle it because everything else was dirt easy up until that point

It’s just epeen nonsense.

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When people say this, I believe, they aren’t talking about raiding technically they are talking about some weird romanticized sense of the spirit of raiding. If you’re a literal larry their statement won’t make sense :slight_smile: Though I agree with you, it is raiding because

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Blizzard went into the shortcomings of LFR in detail back in 2014 when they introduced flex.

Here’s a direct quote:

Raiding a single zone with a guild or group of friends can stay engaging for months, and one of the core reasons for that is the pacing of progression through a zone. A raid group might start out learning a new boss or two each week; that pace slows as the raid reaches the later bosses near the end of a zone, and more time each week is spent re-clearing “farm content” to gear up further. This keeps the experience varied, and even if you don’t get the specific loot you were hoping for in a given week, you’re seeing your friends and guildmates progress and get stronger, and you’re feeling the impact of those upgrades as you kill bosses faster and faster. Raid Finder offers none of that. Your ninth clear of the Underhold section of Siege of Orgrimmar is likely no faster than your second (and might even be slower); you aren’t experiencing anything new or different.

They didn’t come flat-out and say “this isn’t raiding”, but they sure talked a lot about the great things about raiding, and how LFR doesn’t have any of them.

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We already know Blizzard treats it as lower caste. And then some in the community follow with that negative attitude. Some of those devs are likely gone now though because they loved the bad touch too much.

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I don’t think you need to look down on LFR players to realize that LFR has a ton of flaws and is probably a bad idea.

I’ve always felt that making people wait in a queue, to get thrown in with random players (many of whom are Not Nice), and get rushed through with GO GO GO and not have time to even look around… isn’t a great experience.

Instead of LFR, they should have a solo experience like Wrath’s “Battle for the Undercity”, where you do the fights with big-name NPC’s to explain the mechanics and do the heavy lifting.

Let people see the story and the content at their own pace, in their own way.

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LFR isn’t raiding so much as it is babysitting a bunch of toddlers as they drool and auto attack a boss that has baby gates set up and still manage to wipe on it.

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Well you can pug through LFG and get some of the same rude experiences. That’s part and parcel to playing online with a bunch of people. But most of my experiences have been positive. It’s the same with dungeons, or open world. Like when fighting off certain enemies to get to a chest and someone comes along and opens it before you can get to it.

I’m not against NPC type instances. FFXIV does that for dungeons. I’m just not exactly sure how good it will be for raiding. I’m also not against Normal and LFR being combined with the option to queue. As long as it’s optional and Normal raiders aren’t forced to queue for it.