LGBTQ+ Megathread & Lounge (Part 2)

[Fuzzbutt-zuljin]

Sad fox noise

Everbody love everybody!

[Maizou-proudmoore (Maizou)]

@Lannislight-wyrmrest-accord

The moderators should start taking count on who likes threads that are bigoted tbh, we see the same ppl in the likes supporting bigots time and time again even if they themselves aren’t posting anything. And perma bans for ppl posting the type of bigoted troll content, bcz why do they always come back.

The fact the “LGBT people are You Know What” thread stayed up for over 24 hours is beyond ridiculous.

[Fuzzbutt-zuljin]

That was horrible

And that person is still posting around i think

[Fairlight-emerald-dream]

@Pharazon-thorium-brotherhood

If anyone would like to have their character participate, please let me know either on here or through discord DMs if I’m in a discord server with you (if you do want in, please tell me charcter+server so I don’t make mistakes).

Would love to participate as a show of camaraderie. (But I don’t want you to feel compelled to add this if it’s extra work. I’m just happy to show support - if even just here through this reply)

Fairlight-Emerald Dream

Fairlight#1833

[Crumpetz-malganis (Crumpetz)]

Probably the worst time for me to rejoin but I do still disagree with assessments months back about someone in the WoW community being presented as a bigot in this thread and others that people in this thread visited. So it does make me question some of the commentary without evidence

[Baridorielor-malfurion (Baridorielor)]

@Sayawa-wyrmrest-accord

You don’t get to ever tell a LGBT person the right or wrong way to be who they are.

… I literally didn’t say anything about who they are…

Where did you get this from?

@Sayawa-wyrmrest-accord

It’s not my job to appease bigots by existing according to their rules.

NOBODY is telling you that. Nobody.

What i’m saying here is not to become WORSE then the bigots.

@Sayawa-wyrmrest-accord

You don’t know anything about what helps us because you don’t,

I’ve been in these circles for awhile now, and i think i know a thing or two here about what works and what doesn’t here. In the case of trying to one up on the bigot, all would that do is guarantee they would just only keep their position and take up more extreme positions.

If you have the power to convince a bigot out of his position and be a better person, would you not take that route?

@Sayawa-wyrmrest-accord

Second, you don’t need to let anyone confirm their intentions when they have it painted on their face.

…Were not even talking about text, just a button press.

How this comes out to “painted on their face” is rather bizarre.

@Sayawa-wyrmrest-accord

If someone shows support for something, I don’t need to ask them why.

Why not? I think it’s good to remind us or others why you do it. Or why you support it. It helps us keep us grounded and not forget why we do it.

@Sayawa-wyrmrest-accord

If someone likes a post saying something homophobic or racist, I’m not going to ask for the circumstances because I’m not disingenuous.

Then explain what shall you do if you see somebody doing just that then…

I mean, assuming that simply ignoring it is out of the question.

---

@Gwenelle-steamwheedle-cartel

…if we keep lists of people who agree with sentiments calling us predators, or threatening us, they might…keep lists of us too? They already do that and worse.

…So can i ask? Why do the same thing their doing then if it’s something they are doing?

I mean, what happened to “Love wins all” exactly?.. Was that not working out or?..

@Gwenelle-steamwheedle-cartel

Liking a post saying “LGBTQ+ people are [expletive or claim]” IS an action. I looked at several of those users, and a number of them I recognized from posts in which they themselves made their politics very clear.

How would a single-like button = their politics? By that logic, do you consider all people who don’t like things you dislike, to align with your politics? Or people who like the things you like?

If i like your comments, how to you, would that be me aligning with your politics? (Even tho i the same direction as you anyways)

It just sounds like you (and Lannis) are introducing an idea that, if it doesn’t provide any harm, it doesn’t provide any help because people on the right would just like the comments to avoid being looked as such… and similar with somebody on the left would like the other, and vice versa. This isn’t even considering the fact the person can simply like both or not like at all.

I mean what then at that point? Count views? And every view for side i dislike = hatred? Comment on thread i dislike = hatred?

This isn’t exactly a situation that can be easily condensed into a simple checkbox. Esp since this seems like it would be abusible by the bigots for them to like both sides of the comments and just be fine because by the logic of this idea, they would just be seen as rather neutral.

@Gwenelle-steamwheedle-cartel

I agree with Sayawa–stay in your lane.

As i’ve said before, i’ve been in these circles for awhile now, to a point where i can pick up on things and etc.

@Gwenelle-steamwheedle-cartel

Stop telling us we don’t have the right to protect ourselves,

NOBODY told you that.

Infact, i think grooming allegations as a whole, is honestly damaging for everybody involved given most of the time their false. LGBT+, Christians, etc etc… It’s something that SHOULDN’T be happening to anybody at all. It’s a heavy accusation that has the power to destroy somebody’s life. And i do feel bad for you people who has to face this sort of problem. And i get it’s frustrating they lump you both together, instead of recognizing you are clearly against that.

@Gwenelle-steamwheedle-cartel

Especially since this proposal would involve no personal info but someone’s forum handle.

I’m for one for Btags. Since it helps makes it easier for account wide ignores and make people responsible for their own actions by allowing the community to know and simply just avoid them until they change their attitude for the better.

What i don’t condone with the use of BTags is to witch hunt people.

[Lannislight-wyrmrest-accord]

The way advocating for mods to notice who consistently likes bigoted posts and act accordingly sent some people into a weird spiral.

[Baridorielor-malfurion (Baridorielor)]

@Lannislight-wyrmrest-accord

The way advocating for mods to notice who consistently likes bigoted posts

…Lannis, you made a racist comment on twitter awhile back and blocked me for calling you out on it. Do you really want this?..

[Lannislight-wyrmrest-accord]

@Baridorielor-malfurion

Lannis, you made a racist comment on twitter awhile back and blocked me for calling you out on it. Do you really want this?..

You inserted yourself into a convo between myself and my friend Baal where you got clocked for feeling that white people had a place to speak over BIPOC on BIPOC issues. You then extended that same sentiment to straight people speaking on LGBTQIA+ issues and men speaking on women’s issues on some “everyone’s equal” centrist line of thinking when you like someone else is telling you in this thread can do with learning to stay in your lane.

[Baridorielor-malfurion (Baridorielor)]

Twitter is public. And what you’ve said is no more messed up if the roles are reversed here.

If you want me to be against bigotry here, i’m going to call out ALL forms of Bigotry here.

[Rosenivy-area-52 (Rosenivy)]

us: just trying to live in a world where people shockingly don’t want us dead
you: YOU A BIGOT

uh huh janet

[Sayawa-wyrmrest-accord]

I’m going to say this solidly and in the nicest way possible: I don’t care what kind of “circles” you’ve been in. As a straight person, your opinion on what helps or harms LGBT people is useless. It doesn’t matter. It’s not worth a penny. You coming in here and thinking you know better than us is a laughable way to show “understanding”.

We, as LGBT people, have lived a lifetime of ridicule and derision and othering that dwarfs whatever “circles” you run in. Because of this, we pick up on danger quick. We’ve seen the same sentences a hundred times, the same rhetoric a million times, the same buzzwords a billion times. I feel comfortable acting on what I believe to be bad intentions because my wife and I experience them every single day.

[Baridorielor-malfurion (Baridorielor)]

…That’s not even what i’ve said here and you know it.

People have the right, regardless of what or who they are, to talk about things in whatever they like. To gate them off because their a certain thing, is discrimination. The opposite of inclusive.

What happened to “love wins all”?..

[Crumpetz-malganis (Crumpetz)]

@Baridorielor-malfurion

What happened to “love wins all”?..

that’s not even the saying lol

[Rosenivy-area-52 (Rosenivy)]

@Baridorielor-malfurion

What happened to “love wins all”?..

And love given to everyone makes love worthless

Given the crap that has happened to me, yeah don’t come in here telling me to be all inclusive.

[Gwenelle-steamwheedle-cartel]

@Baridorielor-malfurion

In the case of trying to one up on the bigot, all would that do is guarantee they would just only keep their position and take up more extreme positions.

Remembering when people hate us and wish us dead isn’t trying to “one up” a bigot. And how can it get MORE extreme than what they were already saying?!

@Baridorielor-malfurion

If you have the power to convince a bigot out of his position and be a better person, would you not take that route?

We don’t have that power. Don’t you think we’d use it if we could?

This is what Sayawa was talking about–you want us to appease them. You think people who are discriminated against should spend their time and energy trying to get bigots to see them as human beings. You are putting the onus on the victims to convince the victimizers not to victimize us.

@Baridorielor-malfurion

…So can i ask? Why do the same thing their doing then if it’s something they are doing?

What you’re doing here–repeatedly–is the fallacy of false equivalence. We ARE NOT doing “the same thing” as them. We are not threatening them or telling them they have no right to exist, or that they are all child predators.

@Baridorielor-malfurion

I mean, what happened to “Love wins all” exactly?.. Was that not working out or?..

The stats on hate crimes show that no Virginia, love doesn’t always win. And why aren’t you preaching this at the bigots who want us to stop existing??

@Baridorielor-malfurion

How would a single-like button = their politics? By that logic, do you consider all people who don’t like things you dislike, to align with your politics? Or people who like the things you like?

Again, false equivalence. No, I don’t think people who dislike something I like to automatically be people against “my politics”. However, when someone ‘likes’ a post telling me I’m a child predator and/or someone who commits SA because of something I can’t change about my very existence, I consider that to be someone who is against my existing. Especially when that fearmongering is currently making things worse for us everywhere.

@Baridorielor-malfurion

Infact, i think grooming allegations as a whole, is honestly damaging for everybody involved given most of the time their false. LGBT+, Christians, etc etc… It’s something that SHOULDN’T be happening to anybody at all. It’s a heavy accusation that has the power to destroy somebody’s life.

Know what else destroys someone’s life? ACTUALLY BEING MOLESTED OR GROOMED. And on top of that, people not believing you. You sound like someone far more invested in defending people accused of terrible things–even with proof–than in showing empathy for those who may well have been victimized.

@Baridorielor-malfurion

What i don’t condone with the use of BTags is to witch hunt people.

With your constant habit of screenshotting posts and then attempting to use them as some sort of leverage over people, you are the last person to complain about “witch hunts”.

[Myfwyc-wyrmrest-accord]

@Baridorielor-malfurion

To gate them off because their a certain thing, is discrimination. The opposite of inclusive.

A “certain thing” being an ideology they choose, a hurtful one at that.

Also hello Tolerance of Intolerance Paradox

[Baridorielor-malfurion (Baridorielor)]

@Sayawa-wyrmrest-accord

I don’t care what kind of “circles” you’ve been in

I’ve been in LGBT+ circles. The very same thread since the begining to now.

@Sayawa-wyrmrest-accord

As a straight person, your opinion on what helps or harms LGBT people is useless. It doesn’t matter. It’s not worth a penny

Sayawa, I would assume based on your comments is you support LGBT+ to stop discrimination against them. Meaning you fully understand what discrimination does.

So why, pray tell, discriminate other people based on what they are, giving reason bigots to do so back?

…How exactly you even come to the conclusion i know better then you? I’m simply giving you advice. Bigots are not idiots like you think they are. I mean besides the obvious ones that is?..

@Crumpetz-malganis

that’s not even the saying lol

You get what i mean.

@Rosenivy-area-52

And love given to everyone makes love worthless

…I’m sorry, What???

@Rosenivy-area-52

Given the crap that has happened to me, yeah don’t come in here telling me to be all inclusive.

…Isn’t LGBT+'s original idea is to try to be inclusive?.. Or be included?..

[Rosenivy-area-52 (Rosenivy)]

@Baridorielor-malfurion

…Isn’t LGBT+'s original idea is to try to be inclusive?.. Or be included?..

Not to people that straight up tried to kill me at one point.

Being inclusive doesn’t mean being a damn doormat

[Crumpetz-malganis (Crumpetz)]

@Baridorielor-malfurion

You get what i mean.

I do get what you mean now. You so carefully detailed it out for me it’s hard to miss. You use the common trope of “Aren’t you preaching acceptance???”.