Apparently not.
And their main point was removing a mandatory pick and to put that damage into other abilities. So… remove cleaving strikes and come up with something interesting for aoe other than “DnD make Obliterate go aoe. It was a compounding issue to a confined space for 12 seconds. (even though its bigger than it looks”.
DK aoe used to have much longer ramp, tied to diseases, DnD and Blood Boil.
DnD is not the problem, cleaving strikes is. Its just boring and lazy design.
Two extra buttons won’t kill you. The majority are asking for some depth, or at the very least potential for depth with a less competitive build option akin to single-minded fury.
You want depth, go play windwalker and leave my simple fun spec alone.
Two more buttons means I’m out of keybinds.
Are you using a moba mouse? You can easily slot 3 rows of talents, and most specs in the game use these. You can macro burst cds like pillar if you really need to. Frost dk is one of the few specs I’ve played where I have tons of empty spaces in my usual setup.
A quick look at their profile shows they’re 100% talking about Unholy, which still has a very real button bloat issue.
Yeah, UH could actually use some streamlining. Feels like they took everything pre-legion themed around green and slapped it all on UH, leaving both frost and blood feeling empty while UH feels excessive.
Returning to 3 rune types would fix a lot of these specs, but if they can’t do that, all 3 need full reworks.
Definitely do not bring back rune types.
+1, though I do like rune types for flavor & thematics. In a hypothetical where they were brought back, I’d rather see them split as a player choice for 3:3, with each giving a benefit when used, such as:
Again, I’d like to see the runes come back thematically, but I do feel death runes work better overall than having ot juggle rune types.
Full reworks it is then
Just want to bump this thread, the problems with dk are made even more obvious in 10.1.5 and this class is in desperate need for a rework. Their state in m+ is laughably bad and awful to play.
DK main since Wrath. I am now playing a different class.
As you said Dk is stale. Its not fun at all anymore. Frankly, I also think the rotation for unholy is clunky and suffers from button bloat. There is way too much to manage in the background of a fight in addition to the mechanics. I almost quit the game during Sanctum of Domination over how unfun Unholy is to play.
DKs are in such a piss poor state because legion stripped all the tools away and shoved them into separate specs in a way no other class was pruned. The entire DK identity revolved around using multiple resources to activate separate parts of your class, so you were never forced to use just a single ability type.
Rogues, for example, all got to keep things like ambush, but a frost dk completely lost the ability to spread diseases. Fast forward to shadowlands, and nearly every other class was restored to its former glory (think warriors all getting access to stances, ignore pain, etc.), but death knights were screwed by their core designs because the multi-spec crossover was locked behind rune types that no longer existed.
Now, even in DF, we’re still suffering from a bland and stripped down frost and blood dk with UH having every “green” ability mindlessly tossed into the kit for the sake of the supposedly outdated class fantasy aspect of the game that was intended to be unpruned. So still, we are the ONLY class in the game that hasn’t been restored completely because of the way we were separated, and I’ll never forgive it until it’s fixed.
(Just want to note that I don’t want to return to having separate runes, but something more along the lines of death runes for all 3 so that more tools can be viably used. At the very least, a full rework that should have happened in Legion should take place so all 3 specs feel complete and, more importantly, fun.)
I wish you mentioned soul reaper. It needs to cost runic power. Otherwise i agree, chill streak is garbage.
Ehh… not that breath gets played alot, but making SR cost runic power would make it unusable in a breath build.
I personally would like them to turn fester strike into the ret talent for crusade strike and have fester strike apply wounds with auto attacks. Also move aotd & super strain to general tree for all dks.
I think it’s time breath received a total overhaul so frost dk can have fun and fluid runic spenders without being affected by breath. That single ability is so divisive that it prevents major changes being made to frost, and this spec desperately needs an overhaul.
As much as I love breath, I agree.
I think breath should be changed in 1 of 2 ways:
You could even go further down the fire breath route and make RP spent during breath extend/empower breath.
There is a problem with frost, not unholy.
Unholy is “fine” with the two~three pvp build variations.
What I would still change a little bit, would be the damage of the fastering strike, it is still not a very “ok” skill to use - it needed a 10% increase or a cost reduction…but otherwise, the Desease build with DnD(defile) + blight is good in pvp so far.
Other than that, I believe that one more option to choose in place of the army of death would be interesting, for example, a talent that gives a small chance to summon an undead malee from the ground. Why ? because a skill of 8 minutes CD in pvp is still surreal.
I would also put the option of unholy being able to have dual wield, instead of two handed. Why ? because it makes perfect sense to me, frost has a huge history of being two handed, unholy is a duelist / fast class because it always had this footprint of causing quick damage. This is so true that haste is needed as much as mastery, for builds like desease.
The problem is with the frost build. It has a problem with dealing damage only to exact windows. It’s easy to avoid, requires a lot of handling, and is usually way down in all situations - dmg, CD and control.
Apart from the problems with frost, I don’t understand the part about - “the problem dk has since X expansion” - that some of you are talking about here.
What I could say is that I’ve never seen pvp being worked on as much as it is currently and, that at the most there is a VISUAL problem in unholy, where some fight animations are still weird.
Those things aside, I don’t see that many problems with unholy at the moment.
Then you are truly blind.
The entire core mechanic of Festering Wounds is sheer insolence.
They are Classic Rogue Combo Points but worse and had to be buffed by 250% recently to be somewhat viable and only restricted to PvP.
In PvE this mechanic is supposed to be our main source of damage but an AoE application (beside the talent ‘Vile Contaigon’ every 1.5 min) is not possible and thus not being worth to tab target.
It’s like a rogue would try to manually apply Rupture to all targets via tab targeting.
In a raid environment where you are focused on pure single target you are highly dependent on PI to succeed.
Ok maybe in pvE it’s a problem.
In pvp, between 1600~1800, the ROT build has been working well, and I have my build incomplete (normally, I would have 1500 more mastery, I’m still building it and it still works fine)
blight, defile, plaguebringer, ebon fever, are skills that do a lot of damage in pvp (at least now).
defile increases 8% of mastery…mastery increases shadow damage, virulent plague is shadow…plaguebringer makes deseases occur 100% faster, ebon fever makes virulent occur 15% more frequently…with the correction of virulent plague duration, it is possible to keep reapplying and using scourge strike, making the enemy melt for deseases.
With high mastery (3k+), defile, Haste above 2.5k…the damage is big.
that’s not counting other burst skills, which help in kill situations.
I don’t know if the situation changes above 1800 but…for me it’s “ok” now.
If the player prefers, they can change the strategy to pet damage, or direct damage. It works.
only thing in pvp that is complicated for unholy, now, is survival.