Even if Blizzard loses they win, and they win big! You see all this talk about M+? Means it’s winning man cause controversy and with that breeds popularity.
Without that no one would care and truly then they’d take the L, but they are most certainly taking the W.
All the changes are keeping this game mode from stagnation.
It keeps the pot stiring so the soup is more delicious
And boy are they cooking!
W
All I know is that BlizZard needs to learn how to win again. M+ is their baby since Legion and if they dumpster it then the future of retail is very cloudy.
As you can see they are morphing what Retail means even now. From a BR, MoP remix, new ways to fly, and more this is just the beginning of a new WoW. They know change is hard for people and yet so needed if WoW is to last another 20 years.
It’s gonna be a wild ride.
The Saga is just the beginning of the new world.
True but M+ and Delves are the future of WoW but they are holding onto raiding like it is a baby blanket.
They need to let it go!
Who knows what the future holds. Perhaps something far greater than anything we’ve seen yet?
Blizzard Skunk Works hard at work I bet.
ha ha it is funny because nobody has a phone
Heroic was a joke at the start of a season.
With the recent updates it just seem like blizz doesnt understand…
This is like the movie moneyball all over. where we the customer wants something and we got a bunch of devs telling us they know what the problem is.
Blizz try to understand this: We all know your shortcut solution to everything - NERF IT.
But since we have more classes than specs and hero talents that i can even remember, you decided to move in this direction but when an class becomes OP the answer should be nerf it, but how to make other classes just as good.
When you make other classes just as good / buff the rest then we truely have a freedom of choice and that promotes diversity in classes and specs in different scenarios.
When you nerf something you just creating a platform for another spec to take its spot, then are you gonna nerf that spec as well???
20 years on and we still show faith in you but it seems YOU KNOW NOTHING JOHN SNOW
We don’t have a tank problem, never did. It’s a DPS problem, because everyone wants to be the edgy little DPS thinking they’re gonna top the charts… the players quitting tanking because it’s, “too hard” that’s just a skissue.
We do but we don’t use the phones for gaming I personally use the phone for calls,messages,Discord,browsing forums,googling stuff etc…
Although I did try to play mobile legends on the phone but I can’t get used to mobile controls xD.
PC for life.
Keyboard is so much better by miles.
This is wrong, and you have clearly not seen the numbers. The numbers were growing pretty much all season. Only 4 weeks or something where the numbers actually dropped below the starting point.
Nice try though
It isn´t some kind of coincidence that so many ppl mention S4 of BFA as the most fun they had with M+. Numbers prove us correct. The funniest part to me, however, is that even amongst the M+ tryhards, they have S4 of BFA as their favourite seasons. Same goes for Legion. Somehow the seasons that were ooooh so flawed from a QoL point, wee somehow better… Hmmm… Kind of like how Classic on paper with its billion QoL issues should never succeed, and yet it does. Again and again and again.
I think I get what your problem is. You do not understand that the problem with current m+ is a complete lack of fun. It isn´t something you can just magically change with some QoL change.
There is nothing Blizzard can do to ever grow m+ in its current state during a season, without completely changing it.
M+ used to focus on fun. It doesn´t anymore.
If it makes you feel better, lots of content creators make the same mistakes as you. Oh, but once we remove affixes, it will all be good!! Once we do this QoL change it will be better!!
No M+ fundamentally sucks as it currently is, and needs massive changes. Which are not exactly difficult to pull off since we alrdy know what used to work.
I think i get what your problem is. You do not understand that all content participation drops off over time.
It has nothing to do with “current state of m+” as participation pretty well mimics itself season after season since at least BFA
I personally think this is the best season yet because of its difficulty. I was getting so tired of walking training dummies.
However the bugs in the game currently are frustrating. Why do people still fall through the ships in Dawnbreaker?!
read: “it’s too hard”
You’re correct, I was mistaken about the nature of the season. Thank you for the clarification. Week 17 and 18 saw bumps after week 16 being the largest dip of the season so far.
Yes, and I am one person who does rank BFA S4 as my favorite M+ season. Nothing in my statement was disputing that BFA S4 was a popular season. Just that much of your list was between incomplete or left out massive changes that took an aspect from something the season was doing well with in spite of to something that could contribute to a positive attitude toward the season.
Corruptions were not deterministic until mid-season when Blizzard added a vendor with a 4-week rotation of supplies. We still had all of the awful affixes that hadn’t been massively nerfed (bolstering that never expired, sanguine that was massive and healed twice as fast, bursting that couldn’t be dispelled, grievous, explosives that required actual DPS to kill at mid-to-high key levels, etc.). Azerite was still not a popular replacement of tier sets despite having finally been changed to be mostly usable, with an endless AP grind being complained about daily.
Just because on the whole there seems to have been more players having fun with M+ doesn’t mean there weren’t gripes with the system as a whole. Corruptions still provided some cool and wacky things like Twilight Devastation and reaching hard caps of secondary stats even without being deterministic. Awakened is probably the single best example of kiss/curse we’ve ever seen in WoW, especially since all levels of play could use it in a cool way and the cost of messing it up just meant you could revert back to the way you ran the dungeons the first three seasons.
This is an oversimplification. There are probably hundreds of differences between any two seasons cross expansions that trying to boil down why the participation is what it is to just a few factors is always going to paint an incomplete picture. Shadowlands brought one of the least like expansion-wide systems ever into WoW that Blizzard doubled down on into season 2. Dragonflight shifted the entire damage intake paradigm from mostly tank to almost entire group, making it much harder on healers especially if DPS aren’t making good use of their own survival tools. TWW chopped off the level of keys that 30% of all keys were run at even after valor farming was removed. Even if we could show that keys were more fun on the whole back in the day, there’s simply no way to say how much the various QoL changes contributed in either direction on a fun scale.
Even while BFA S4 itself was running strong before corruptions were able to be purchased deterministically, the system itself was awful until that point. It was optimal to run every world quest for items that were up to 50 item levels lower than what you wearing just for the chance it would have the right corruption for your spec. I doubt many people found that aspect of the season, fun.
And it’s also completely subjective and completely impossible to to design for directly. What you find fun may not be different from what I find to be fun. Do you honestly think Blizzard M+ designers are sitting in a room trying to come up with what would make the mode less fun for players?
Yet again, you’re vastly oversimplifying the situation here. While there are very likely competing priorities between the designers and upper management in which some mechanic the designers know will be unfun will make it into the game in the name of maximum profit, M+ design is complicated and has to fit within the overarching WoW ecosystem.
Blizzard receives all sorts of feedback from all directions about what players want, oftentimes with that feedback conflicting. For instance, in Shadowlands where Explosives died if you just looked at them funny, a lot of DPS players were happy to relegate that as a healer affix and thus free for them; yet healers were largely begging Blizzard to do something about them. It’s far from an exact science finding what the most number of players would find fun.
But more importantly than feedback, there have been massive changes to the fabric of the game since Dragonflight that have a drastic impact on the design of the entire game, including M+, mostly around the talent system. All players have so many defensives and healers have such increased healing power when compared to Shadowlands that M+ did need to significantly ratchet up the damage intake to have any chance at having an engaging difficulty. And then when players struggled with that change, affixes that also demand more direct attention become tougher to navigate.
I’m not saying Blizzard didn’t go too far with this, they very well may have. But short of changing the entire design of our player power levels to be more in line with what we had in Shadowlands and before, the M+ designers can’t just plug what worked for M+ mechanics on their own because they would have different interactions with how the rest of the game has changed. Perhaps that is what you are suggesting; but I would greatly oppose going back to the 7-talent row system we had since MoP compared to what we have now. I’m on board for Blizzard to keep trying to find an enjoyable structure for M+, but just going back to the past isn’t the answer as far as I’m concerned. They need to find a new structure that is enjoyable that fits within larger design of the game.
Yes, that is the problem.
They increase the difficulty, raise the bar as the did going from S3 and S4 of DF to S1 of TWW, and there’s people who could do the highest level reward content (myth track vaults) and could farm the highest crests in previous seasons and now they no longer can (or seriously struggle to).
It’s moving the goal post in difficulty for rewards where you now have to play at a “lower level” than you did before which feels ridiculously bad.
the only way they’ll “take the L”, is if you vote with your wallet and stop supporting this trash.
Everyone unsubbed during the mass exodus to FFXIV a few years ago, and blizz hiked up their socks and re-added the Mage Tower, removed the AOE cap, added a tonne of char customization options, amongst a few other QOL aspects.
All stuff they had in their back pocket when people decidedly had enough of their shenanigans.
Let’s see more of that self-control we had that one time, and actually affect change again.
so a thing is only fun to the extent it gives you the rewards you want? hmm. that feels very transactional.
A reward system is part of video games. I’m not sure what’s difficult to understand about this.
And also, as I said, not being able to do content at a level you previously did that content does not feel good.
It still has a reward system
They had 1 season where they got an inflated ego and now they think thats their norm when in reality, theyre back to their norm and its touching on something oh so fragile
