Jaina seemingly not knowing who Valeera was in BfA was weird, and seemingly a lore anomaly unless Jaina is suffering from memory loss. Valeera fought alongside Jaina and Varian in the Alliance version of the Battle for the Undercity, the aftermath of the Wrathgate scenario that is no longer in game, but is still canon.
Regarding the Shadowlands intro, I can think of reasons for both Calia and Valeera being present in the scenario, but based on what we know of them I don’t think they should be there in place of Horde leaders. We know Anduin was abducted, Valeera would be concerned, and I could see her wanting to be there for his sake. As for Calia, she may be taking advantage of the situation to see what’s left of the mess her brother left in Northrend, nevermind whatever her relationship to the Horde council is at that point in the story. Why not have them go stand elsewhere, rather than positioning them with the Horde? Darion and Bolvar are both present standing apart from the Alliance and Horde groups, so there are other neutral people there. Also, regardless of whether or not Calia is a leader, Valeera definitely isn’t, so she shouldn’t be taking the place of one.
Didn’t consider that this is could be a weird sort of Worf Effect where Sylvanas hate-crushing on Anduin is intended to keep ramming the villain bat home and reinforce their roles as the baddest and the goodest characters, respectively.
Malfurion mentions the change in Tyrande during WC3 itself so this is unsurprising.
Tyrande has gotten arrogant over the years(“Only the goddess may forbid me!”) and despite having gotten philosophical at times her arrogance is still there.
When others criticize her she gets angry and when others praise her she gets angry… It’s entitled behaviour without Narcissism and internal self doubt… Sounds suspiciously like Borderline Personality Disorder…
Interestingly enough Sylvanas seems to have no personality traits aside from caring about her family members, pitying the Forsaken, discarding both when they rejected her and finally her vanity(admiring her reflection and wanting to take everyone’s breath away) that cares little for compliments or even attention.
Sylvanas is vain yet not Narcissistic(like N’Zoth) or Histrionic(like Azshara)… Nor is she a Borderline(like Tyrande) or a Sociopath(like Sargeras) or Psychopath(like the Dreadlords)… A very dangerous villain indeed…
More to the point, your assuming she is acting rationally when possessed by the vengeful aspect of her god. If anything since that has happened she is clearly not acting rationally. Like the blood curse the orcs had, whatever power ups the Night Warrior might give her it seems to also effect her judgement and play on her desire for vengeance.
It was a forbidden ritual. Did people think it would just be some type of benign power up?
She pretty much is though, everything suggests that. We’re only missing a corpse but the rest says she’ll die…
Well if it was going to have such devastating consequences, why did that ritual still not put her on the level of Nathanos in terms of power?
Since Nathanos is canonically stronger, I don’t see a reason for him to be part of and ruin the entire resolution and revenge plot for the Night Elves in 8.1. He shouldn’t have been there in the first place but that’s another topic.
The Night Warrior ritual was supposed to be a cool moment for Night Elves, not just lead right into the death of their leader and then that’s all of it.
You literally have datamined dialog about how you can save her from the fate of the Night Warrior in Shadowlands AFTER this event. You have jack all to base this assumption on. What ‘rest’ is saying she will die?
Who knows? The whole thing was stupid from the beginning. I said it then and I will say it now. Frankly I think it would have been far better just to have the NE’s kick some butt without a emo mcguffin. It, and the undead NEs, were entirely unnecessary.
By the way, what are we basing this Canonic strength of Nathanos on? He was losing his fight against Tyrande even powered up by a Valkyr.
Even if there were ways to save her, who’s to say that it won’t fail like everything else the Night Elves ever tried to do?
Some examples are:
Stopping the Horde in the war of thorns
saving civilians in darnassus
Stopping Nathanos
reclaiming our lands
getting justice for Teldrassil
Everything failed. Keeping Tyrande alive will expand that list, it’s on the writers to prove that they can do it differently and they most certainly won’t do that.
Her death has been heavily foreshadowed and the writers just want her gone now since they think that they resolved everything in 8.1 already.
We have her death foreshadowed, we have voicelines saying that her fate is sealed and we have the fact that Nathanos and Sylvanas could both easily kill Tyrande.
Again, I’d love to be proven wrong one time ever but that never happens. And if the writers can’t make that happen they’ll just keep proving me right over and over again.
Eh, Tyrande was in trouble before Malfurion intervened. Nathanos said something like “Now you can finally rejoin your loved ones” when he was about to strike her down, then Malfurion intervened and after a rather long and boring fight, Nathanos mounted up with his undead Night Elves and fled.
From how they portrayed it, without Malfurion Nathanos would’ve striked her down. Otherwise there was no reason to involve Malfurion in the fight, if Tyrande was really stronger she would’ve made Nathanos flee alone, but they included Malfurion to show that Tyrande can’t do it alone.
That part…
Malfurion had to intervene until they were able to make Nathanos flee.
And the fact that this is all the Night Warrior did before it killed her is… laughable really. They could’ve done so much with the Night Warrior and decided to just throw it out of the window, just like the resolution and justice plot after Teldrassil…
It’s still a very bad presentation. The writers knew that this patch would be the resolution and revenge for Teldrassil, so what would be appropriate for that?
Definitely not making Tyrande as the Night Warrior and Malfurion combined take ages to finally make Nathanos retreat and not even put a scratch on him…
They should’ve left out Nathanos altogether then, and it just makes things worse when Malfurion intervenes in the middle of the fight because that shows that Tyrande wouldn’t have been capable of defeating Nathanos herself.
Who is to say they will fail. Your stating something is going to happen and your argument for why it is definitely going to happen is there isn’t anything saying it definitely won’t happen.
Plus the NEs did drive off Nathanos and reclaimed Darkshore so no, not everything failed. Your being melodramatic.
Oh please, Tyrande was kicking his butt. Sure he talked crap and at one point got a trap on that she broke out of herself but he was clearly losing. Wasn’t Malfurion fighting one of the Valkyr? Nathanos wasn’t fighting alone. You have actually done the event since the Beta right?
Seems like your just switching arguments now your original assumption didn’t carry weight. You are proactively trying to paint the situation in the worse possible light just to justify your melodrama.
We have a history of failure, I told you already what the Night Elves failed with in BfA alone and trying to save Tyrande would expand that list.
Our objective was to stop Nathanos from raising the dead Night Elves…
That’s not how it was portrayed at all.
Uh no we just came to the topic, I still answered to you.
Again, if the writers can prove that they can do more with Tyrande then sure, but they won’t do that and everyone that has a little bit of sense left can see that.
They hate Night Elves, they see themselves as Nathanos and Sylvanas so their next step will be killing Tyrande off as they have heavily foreshadowed and hinted already.
What are we even discussing for when it’s just obvious ?
And once it happens, instead of admitting that I was right everyone will start making fun of it and start mocking me and other night elf fans because Tyrande died, it’s the same thing everytime.
Again your saying something is a fact because there is not definitive proof that it is the complete opposite. The reality is, we don’t know yet. Saying it is the case when we don’t have that information pretty baseless and I doubt they would have a whole quest chain about learning the nature of the Night Warrior and how to stop it only to decide ‘no screw it!’
The initial goal when arriving in Darkshore was to reclaim it which the Night Elves did do. It factually happened.
Yeah it is. You can watch Nathanos’ health bar going down while hers barely moves.
Wow you have a huge victim complex going on. Alright. Sulk. Whatever floats your boat. Do a Marvin, the depressed robot impersonation in the back of every forum thread if that is what you want. Don’t expect people to take you seriously though.
We don’t have to say “no screw it”. We can just try and fail, like all the other times.
The goal was to reclaim their home and have justice. Both of them failed, the justice plot ended in 8.1 and they didn’t get justice in 8.1 and Ashenvale would’ve been part of their lands too.
Looking at the fight itself and not at the health bars, it looked like Nathanos was dominating up until Malfurion arrived.
No matter how you turn it, it’s still not a proper resolution for Teldrassil.
It´s so plain and evident it actually hurts, gal. The fact alone the 3 most disgusting self inserts of Christie Golden will take front and center relevance while staying static development wise (I mean, Baine is STILL a damsel in distress enamoured with Blanduin and nothing else) says it all.
