Layering - What am I missing?

WoW Classic WoW Classic General Discussion
203

If they think this will be the outcome the servers will die just as much if not more a month in once they take it off. You assume layering will solve this in the longterm which simply isn’t the case. If players have more friends/community from no layering they are probably more likely to invite more people to their server months into the game where as they would just quit and leave instead from the layering experience.

This dead server issue makes no sense unless they were going to be keeping it forever. Stuffing it in a few weeks won’t help suddenly save realm pops from dying.

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204

There are a lot of currently subscribed retail players, who when they entered the stress tests brought up their issues being “mob competition”, and further on people worry about “the launch experience” as in queues, lag etc, on top of that “competition”.

Those are constant concerns coming from that audience. What, are we gonna pretend they don’t exist and not discuss them to see if it’s worth addressing those in the big picture? Sounds like an attitude i’ve seen before here somewhere…

All i can see from your message is that you’re out to smear people who discuss those concerns with actual arguments, by labeling them with BS, trying to make you look like you’ve got it all figured out, which i and many people can see couldn’t be further from the truth.

Especially now where videos are popping up left and right, proving what we’ve been saying all along, and disproving your “server health experience > healthy game experience” stance as people really don’t like what they see and change their mind as they actually see layering work the way it does ingame.
Makes sense, cause it’s not the same game.

I’m not sure you realize that dismissing players who’re willing to discuss issues about layering like this just shows you’re on shaky ground, and you wanna prevent actual discussion from happening.

Guess what, there are many people who care about this issue, and if you don’t even want to fairly acknowledge their concerns, please keep going on ahead, because it makes your side of the argument seem really desperate and out of breath if you have to resort to petty smearing like that.

This game is still being tested, so it’s very helpful to point out issues so they can change stuff as needed, or leave things as they are in other cases.
It’s whole purpose is to find issues and bugs, and see if the play experience lives up to their vision. Right now, a lot of people say it doesn’t, and layering is the biggest culprit of why the game doesn’t come across right.
Call their view and concerns whatever BS you want, but it doesn’t make it any less real or valid.

If it’s on live, or live with the same issues it’s too late to fix, the damage will already have been done at the most untimely period where people come back to see if it’s the same game they loved.

205

Prove it.

Common sense and the beta show that non-fanatic people will get excited about the concept, and bored or put off by the reality. Layering prevents the need for more servers to avoid queues.

If they had enough players to keep layering forever… we wouldn’t need layering.

206

Here it is:“judged over a period of time to be of the highest quality and outstanding of its kind.”
It doesn’t say anything about something that can never be changed.
When you go to a classic car show, 99% of the cars are built with new aftermarket parts & some are just outright kit cars. You almost never see a 100% original.

207

I just have a very simple question for you.

Would you describe yourself as a fan of Classic WoW, or of Blizzard?

To me you seem to be going by your post count alone. But i figured i’d ask you personally!

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208

I haven’t been on the forums for years, until Classic came back. I play retail purely for the storyline and haven’t raided in years because it lost the community and the RPG.

I’m a fan of the original Blizzard model and a big fan of Vanilla, but I’m also a software developer working with large scale cloud services, so I have a different view on what works in the infrastructure. I understand how these sort of deployment models work, for “fan driven” environments in addition to normal business models.

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209

Because people will drop off after level cap as well. Common sense shows no layering fosters communities which give constant growth (vanilla-wotlk). Also no way high pop streamer or other popular played servers will die down that quick so by introducing layering and taking it away you are killing them even more than you would with no layering.

210

It’ll be removed within three weeks. Assuming a 2 year lifespan, that’s 1.9% of the game. I’m sure everyone will claim differently, but very few communities were built in the first three weeks of the game. People were far more focused on working how to play, and made some friends, but not intertwined communities.

This is a maelstrom in a bowl.

211

If layering kills the experience for those players that’s 100% of the game. I met the majority of my longterm friends leveling in Vanilla and I would not have been friends with any of them if layering were a thing because we bonded through frequent meetings in the world.

212

The only people who will notice such that it “kills the game” are people obsessed with hating layering. Who are to obsessed to quit over it. People who aren’t obsessed with layering aren’t going to notice it in any significant way.

Your concern trolling is … wait haven’t we had this conversation…

213

You said you saw those videos. If you did you would know every single player will notice it and the unnoticed things (lack of the same players being in their layer) will result in no friends made.

I think you must be the one trolling if you can ignore all these game-breaking issues. You must really be wanting to play this as a single player game because anyone who cares about community wouldn’t suggest killing it so strongly.

214

We all have different experiences. I made my first sort of friends in WoW around level 20-30 and didn’t meet my stronger long-term friends until BC and LK really (I was around level 40ish when BC launched). It was dungeons and raids that ended up making some of the stronger friendships though I met my best in-game friend on the forums of all places.

I get uneasy trying to group with strangers (so I don’t do lfr or lfg much at all) and that also goes with my leveling habits. I will group with people who invite me for named quest mobs or for killing quests but I don’t usually talk much and politely drop when I think it is appropriate. I prefer less crowded leveling and to confine my social interactions to a guild (especially since it is hard for me to have a conversation and play my character at the same time).

I don’t want an empty world but I don’t like being crowded at bottleneck quests either which is what I keep running into in Current WoW because of the sharding where they force a bunch of people into a zone to keep it ‘busy’. I don’t want to see long term layering but I don’t want launch day to feel ruined because of too many people fighting for mobs either. It really ruins my immersion in the game to be asked by an npc to go thin out the boars when there are no boars to be seen.

215

I also said that Layering exploits need to be fixed. Demanding it be removed is simply distracting from the useful discussion by demanding something that will not happen.

216

Because people need something to be outraged over, at all times. The real problem with payering is that too many people are paying attention to those that are whining over it, and now people think it’s a big deal. I wonder how many times blizzard has to facepalm and groan when they see just how whiny and entitled their fans are on a daily basis.

217

Then focus on the fixes. Dismissing these problems of people pointing out the layering issues means Blizzard is less likely to see the problem. Blizzard can make the distinction of what to do with it in the end but they should know the players have a problem with its current implementation.

Like I told you before it’s better to err on the side of caution.

218

Sure. But if people are moving the goalposts from what Blizzard has said are requirements, the discussion is a pointless attempt by people to remove layering.

What, aside from “It’ll wreck the economy!” and “Mah community!” are the issues that need to be fixed. I’ve already repeatedly posted my exploit fixes, only to be dismissed by you with two faced arguments.

219

Because if it wasn’t around, there would be something else to be a contrarian about.

220

I’ve seen loads of people against layering agree to meet in the middle. Many have said they feel it’s needed on launch days and the 1-20 zones and most agree with that even if they are against layering as a whole.

The problem people have is that Blizzard hasn’t communicated what they are doing about the issues. Why not do a hard deadline or limit it to certain regions/zones? If it is staying until populations go down what happens to those high pop/steamer servers at the end of phase 1? If they are going to rip it off when it’s not ready anyway why are you having layering past a week at all?

There’s absolutely no reason to have someone in Eastern Plaguelands sharing a layer with someone in Stranglethorn Vale or Elwynn Forest. They can make the layer regions smaller and fix all the exploits/community issues.

221

Originally WOW was full of mining/herb bots that traveled under the terrain and gathered 24/7 for a year+. Didn’t destroy the economy then. I fail to see how all this “layer abuse” will kill Classic in 1 month.

Personally, I’d layer the Non-Contested Zones for a month or so and not layer any contested zone at all. Population will already be spread out decently when people starting hitting 25-30ish

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There are legitimate concerns. Voicing those concerns is not “whining.”