The Elementals?
Yeah. Siding with them is throwing out the baby with the bathwater.
If people are now going to go and defend a being like Hakkar, we should probably stop finding it weird whenever anyone defends run of the mill bad guys like Garithos and Daelin.
Everyone always forgets about the poor Frostmane Trolls.
7 Likes
I don’t
5 Likes
I was hoping to see a big giant Troll rampage in response to Rastakhan’s death. Trolls raging up from Stranglethorn to sack some Alliance towns, Arathi surging down and burning the newly acquired Stromgarde, Witherbark doing the same, etc.
I guess too many “enemy” troll tribes were upset about Zandalar making nice with the Horde or something.
4 Likes
I think it’s important to note that we raid a Troll City every expansion… I am not sure the trolls are capable of rampaging and rising up at this point. They were already struggling to hold their lands, now just add the sheer fact that every major troll settlement has been decimated by the combined efforts of the Alliance and Horde… I mean, Scourge too, but the Scourge have actually done less, tbh.
Edit: Twilight’s Hammer too… RIP Dark Trolls.
pretty much all troll tribes should join the horde.
4 Likes
Eeeeeh, I don’t think the Amani would want too, considering the Horde aligned themselves with the Blood Elves, and attacked Zul’Aman at least once. Along with the Alliance.
Zul’Gurub, it’s hard to say how many of them are still Atal’Hakkar, and I am not really sure in what shape the Sandfury and Drakkari are.
Though, I wouldn’t be surprised if the new customization options in Shadowlands will include different types of trolls.
I still think Blood Trolls should have been a reluctant ally of Convivence for the Alliance. Just because… I like Blood Trolls… and you know, Enemy of my Enemy and all that.
1 Like
Slow down, ARATHI never belonged to the Amani empire, not at any time. The original inhabitants of that lands are the humans…even since the oldest days
It did pre-sundering.
2 Likes
WOOW…pre Sundering.year…pre sundering were many things different.
I am just saying, Arathi -did- belong to the Amani Empire before humans settled it. It’s difficult to know if the Amani were still there at the time of the Arathi Tribe, but what we do know is the Empire of Arathor was conquered from trolls.
This kind of logic has always struck me as flawed. The Trolls were there before humans, and the Old Gods were there before the Trolls, and the Elementals were there before the Old Gods, and Azeroth was there before any of them, and Humans, Dwarves, and Gnomes are descended from Titan Constructs made from Azeroth’s literal stone and all, so…
Its just a bad line of thought in general.
1 Like
And? The entirety of Azeroth was ruled by the Old Gods who were all beaten by the titan constructs, the ancestors of Humans, Dwarves, gnomes etc. Which mean the ancestors of said creatures at one point reconquered those lands as well.
There is a reason titan artifacts/ruins are everywhere
… So, saying something came before something else, with proof, is flawed? I don’t understand.
If you are talking about rights to land ownership… I don’t think that’s a matter of who was there first, but the cultural and ancestral significance that land has to a people, as well as it’s inhabitance.
Man, all I say is the Amani were in Arathi first, and all the human fan boys are REEEEEEing
I was talking about land rights, and I think trying to measure something like cultural and ancestral significance to determine who has a right to land is equally foolhardy. I mean, I recall Horde dialogue for Alterac Valley claiming the Alliance was trying to remove the Frostwolves from their rightful, ‘Ancestral,’ lands. I remember staring at that word wondering just how that works, when I doubt they’ve even been on Azeroth long enough for a single generation of Orcs to die of old age, much less the Frostwolves.
This idea also gives Dwarves carte blanche to claim all of Azeroth because their Titan ancestry is incredibly significant to them. The idea that the dwarves had a rightful claim to, say, southern barrens, and were the rightful owners of the lands the Stonespire Tauren tribe had been on, utterly cheapens the entire narrative of that particular Horde questline.
The above having been said, I don’t really think there is a good way to validate land ownership rights in Warcraft.
1 Like
First, orcs have been pretty consistent with claiming land that is rightfully theirs based on totally baseless assertions. Orcs think everything belongs to them.
I also do not think the Dwarven argument you are making is really… Well, it’s not even a relevant point. The Stonespire Tauren are the people who have the ancestral and cultural connection tot he land… that’s the very reason WHY players tend to sympathize with them in that quest. If anything, that proves my point.
All i am saying is that most of the tribes should join the horde now that the zandalari have joined.
2 Likes
Except you said that land should go to those who have the most significant cultural and ancestral connection to it. For Dwarves that is pretty much ALL of Azeroth, but especially anywhere with Titan facilities/ruins. I mean, the former king of Ironforge is now the very Speaker for Azeroth herself. Titan stuff is major for Dwarves.
By comparison, a race of nomads who can’t stay on one piece of land despite being nomads, isn’t really all that significant by contrast. The Stonespire Tribe were destroyed for denying the Dwarves their rightful, ancestral claim to those lands (which living dwarves have never stepped on, but again, Titan stuff).
It thoroughly cheapens the narrative.
Lol, no it’s not. You are using an extreme example and drawing a false equivalency from it. Khaz’modan is the region that had the most significant cultural and ancestral connection to the Dwarven people. Arguable some places in Northrend, but rarely anywhere else.
Not true, there are plenty of nomadic tribes the moved from place to place within a particular region, that is culturally significant to them in some way. Other Nomadic tribes may not be connected to the land in such a way at all, but that is unlikely.
No, the Stonespire were destroyed due to greed and a failed diplomacy.