Judgement of the Crusader and the Philosophy of Vanilla is Vanilla

WoW Classic WoW Classic General Discussion
41

it’s a low priority debuff so it’s not an issue

ie: it won’t knock off anything important like a Judgement or Curse etc…

42

I thought that behavior was random in Vanilla.

It will be interesting to test that because I never did test that interaction.

43

in early vanilla yes it was an issue but the debuff priority system came out later on and assigned values to each debuff that could be applied from rank 1-4

with the higher the number, the higher the priority - so that a lower number debuff couldn’t knock off a higher one

ie: DoTs can never take off a high prio debuff like a Judgement or a Curse for example

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44

I dunno, theoretical OP question aside, debuff stacking has been monkeyed with on many occasions through the game’s lifetime (because presumably, some things should not stack together in that they end up broken OP- to give you a classic example- sunder and expose armor). Not really the same thing as spell deranking for mana efficiency purposes (or fast R1 frostbolts for the snare in PvP due to faster cast times).

Lots of precedent for ‘most powerful debuff’ overwriting all other similar ones.

But anyway, to the OP, it’s a funny degenerate thing if they all stacked and broke the game. I’m not in the ‘it was in classic, herp!’ camp, so I’d fix it regardless, but that’s just me.

45

I remember HoT priority being something that of a problem for healers… I remember the QQ learning curve on that one in guild chat… LOL

I just distinctly remember being very limited on what DoT’s / debuffs I was allowed as a hunter.

That lead me down the path of thinking the Holy fire debuff would be considered a “No go” kinda like Serpent Sting or MS.

46

it’s all relative - for example Serpent Sting and Ignite are both prio 1 as they are both DoT’s but which one does more damage?

:stuck_out_tongue:

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47

Depends on the player level and how LEET that mage is.

48

well the top DPS parse for Patchwerk on LH is over 3k and that’s from an Ignite Mage and on Thaddius it’s 4.7k

49

Oh I am aware of how they roll that ignite from one mage to the next, It’s actually an impressive process but requires a 3 mages to not die from what I observed in the past.

That’s an entire skill in its own… It’s something that would NEVER take place today because people now days are selfish little jerks that only care about their own DPS values rather than high quality team work.

50

well that’s just it - with Judgement stacking - each Ret Paladin becomes a Force Multiplier for each other and making everyone better as a result.

51

I hope this system works out because playing a paladin is something I look forward too… I have been considering either Paladin or Shaman as my main this time… I have way too many years on a hunter, and I will build another but not as a main this time.

Elemental looks fun too, but not sure. I gotta find out what faction Ill be playing first I guess; that will make the choice for me.

52

to be clear - we did in fact try testing judgement stacking on the Demo - and it did NOT work even though you could learn both rank 1 and rank 2 of Seal of the Crusader in the level restrictions

however, given the sheer number of rampant bugs on the demo (ie: Redoubt wouldn’t proc without a shield equipped) - it may still be possible once Classic goes live so stay tuned

53

Either way I have this strange desire to play a hybrid for some reason, but there is also the desire to play priest this time too…

Soo many good choices in Classic WoW, I cant actually think of a bad class. I know people like to QQ, but in what other version were the classes ever this interesting? TBC had some cool ideas, but for everything they improved they screwed things up in other ways worse than they improved them…

/cough resilience PVP.

54

of which Retribution was the only spec to not receive Resilience on their PvP Arena sets until patch 2.3…

55

What??? Some how I don’t doubt this… It’s likely a stat budget thing, do you have a link to the sets?

56

“Ret Pallies don’t need Resilience cuz they can heal…” - Kalgan in 2.0.1

57

PS here is a quick transcript for what Kevin Jordan had to specifically say about JotC stacking last night:

theloras_paladin: Judgement of the Crusader - would you have been ok with all 6 ranks of it stacking on the same mob/boss in order to do add +829 holy damage to the target?

Would I have been ok with all 6 ranks of it stacking on the same mob/boss to do +holy damage to the target?

Yea, sounds excessive - it also causes composition issues because once you have bonus holy damage then you start adding more and more Paladins and Priests - you can do that at the expense of other classes so we were always striving for a healthy mix like we didn’t want just one and done to be the thing but we also didn’t want 10 to 15 of one type and so mechanics that would have pushed either one of those.

theloras_paladin: right - as an alternate playstyle is all

Yea, I mean that’s a good point Theloras - as long as it doesn’t approach that point of ‘problematic’ then we were all for alternate play styles like this group forms their raid this way and another group forms their raid another way and they’re both doable - we thought that was excellent and having to make minor adjustments - you know certain groups like that based on the quantities of characters and specs you had and the players behind them, we thought was really cool for the game and really healthy.

It’s once you get to certain things cause eventually everyone sort of can figure out the math and if they figure it out so that there’ only one way to do it or one particular way is twice as fast as any other way that’s going to become kind of a problem.

theloras_paladin: right - as an alternate to the min/max cookie cutter world first type raiding guilds

58

Stuff like this is what makes Classic so fun. It’s just a giant sandbox where you can do crazy stuff like this.

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59

If that’s how they actually feel then they need to use Pre-Naxxramas Threat management kits… This includes Taunt because that makes tank swaps harder and forces the DPS to slow the hell down on top of slowing down the pace of the raid.

All these things slow the DPS quite a lot, and in return it indirectly nerfs warrior DPS back to where they belong while buffing hybrid DPS and hunters. =)

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60

inc slippery slope argument lol

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