Because the game made it a 1 handed weapon to fit the horrid idea that was legions artifact weapons, does not make it a 1 handed weapon, Doom hammer is a 2 handed mace. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=luuUE0x7-TY Don’t speak of the dark magic I was there when it was written. Dks need their 2handers and we need to give Doomhammer back to thrall.
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~https://gamepedia.cursecdn.com/wowpedia/thumb/0/09/DoomhammerConcept.jpg/300px-DoomhammerConcept.jpg?version=b26dd43044a53078fb74dc3957680a00
Art depicions of it from WCIII showed it as one-handed, and at least the one above looks much closer to what we see in game, while the one in the cinematic looks thin by comparison. Even back in Vanilla Thrall had a one-handed mace before Doomhammer got its own model (and it continued to be one-handed after that). Toys and figures have shown Doomhammer as one-handed since at least around the time of Cata. It’s been one-handed in HotS since 2015, or however early Thrall might have been added in the beta.
At the end of the day, even if it was up in the air early on, they’ve clearly decided on it being one-handed, and this was a decision that was made, far, far in advance of the Legion artifact. There are way too many examples of it being canonically one-handed over a single cinematic where the model doesn’t even look right.
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One class Vanilla - Cata had more complexity than 4 classes today put together. In other words, the 10 original classes were probably 30+ times harder to balance than they are today. So this should be easy for them. The fact that after 14 years and 2 massive prunings with 2 massive reductions to talent tree changes this should be simpleton stuff for them. I don’t think they want to balance anything.
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The hyperbole of your claim aside, no, classes in Vanilla were not more complex than they are now. They may have toned a few classes back from certain points around Cata, but far and away, classes have more going on now than they did in the earliest itterations of the game. Anyone claiming the opposite is in for a big surprise come Classic release.
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in pandaria the classes were well balanced
Of course, they had their exceptions but all classes had their skills broken and that was fine, or at least I liked to do a kill of 5 strokes or kill me in 5 strokes.
I think that the balance can not be given when there are classes that can barely make little dps, the balance is when all the classes can kill you in 5 hits
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Since most classes used over 30 buttons back then and most use 4 or 5 now your smoking something. Now the only thing you can say is that vanilla had a real rotation, and I forgot that it’s been a long time. But still you had 30+ active buttons or more back then. Soon as the priority based system came out there was still those 30+ buttons we used and then there is nothing today that compares to anything back then. Even in vanilla’s rotation and simple Arms warriors was harder, we had 3 stances which were constantly changing, each stance had it’s own spells that belonged to it, and a hell a lot more to track back then. Go smoke your pipe elsewhere.
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Instead can we 1 hand a 2 hander like Arthas?
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Or dw 2hs, like we have strength. Unnatural strength, even.
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This is disingenuous at best, on both ends of what you’re claiming. Having access to tons of spells in times like Classic, mostly ones you didn’t actually use by virtue of being under different talent trees and as a result being borderline useless in most situations, is not the same thing as using or utilizing all of those spells in a relevant manner. 30+ spells is not a realistic representation of what any class ever used unless you really want to tilt the scales with Shaman’s 21 totems, or every rank of Mage conjure for food, water, and mana gems. Pulling out an old Classic guide, Warriors only had 36 spells total, which includes all seven talented abilities that are spread throughout each tree. Priests have 38 total, Rouges 37… again, counting all talented abilities for all specs. Assuming an even spread between specs, only 2 talented spells (average), some overlap of spell usage between specs, and that every spell within a spec was used (they weren’t) you’re looking at maybe 12-15 keybinds most of the time, and maybe 1-2 extra if you’re a hybrid with the intention of off healing.
Today I can count 18 keybound class abilities that I regularly use in any given raid or dungeon (this is not counting trinkets, racials, potions, etc.); and that’s just as Frost - wait until an Unholy fanboy gets in here. Less has changed than you think, and the idea that we “only use 4-5 abilities” is pure made up garbage.
Also, that “difficult” Arms rotation in Vanilla was Overpower > Slam if 70+ Rage > Mortal Strike > Whirlwind. That’s it. Arms had no reason to stance dance in its PvE rotation, though 2H Fury sometimes did if you were Alliance (Horde was different due to Windfury). Good thing I played a Warrior up until Wrath, huh?
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Even with blood, i still have an offensive bar and a defensive bar.
I think my defense bar has 2 open spots.
Rez is on another bar with pof, so still using 18+. With the 2 bars.
![:wink:](https://d38bqls1q93fod.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/wink.png?v=6" ":wink:")
I am a returning player and was looking forward to making a new death knight only to find out that frost is supposed to be played with 1 handed weapons only… So disappointing…
I even played through most of the intro quests not knowing that I absolutely had to have 1 handed weapons, I assumed I’d miss out on some skills maybe but that there would also be some 2H only skills that would balance it out… nope
I kept wondering while I was doing the intro quests “what am I doing wrong?” cause it seemed a bit hard killing things in frost with 2H lol. I was just using 2 skills cause I thought that’s how I had to play…
I’m not sure why 2H were removed from frost DK to begin with but please bring them back, this makes no sense to me. Would it really be that hard to do?
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The excuse that we can’t have a 2H wielding frost DK because of a “balancing issue” is ludicrous to me.
I’m not saying that bringing this functionality back wouldn’t require work or that it wouldn’t take any time to implement but to say that having a 2H frost DK creates too many unsolvable issues, that it breaks the game and must simply not exist as there is no other solution, is complete and total horse $#%@.
My assumption is that there is another reason why we don’t have 2 handed frost DK, other than math that is, as that is all a “balancing issue” is, math… Maybe this reason is political, maybe they’re just lazy and don’t want to do it. The latter is sounding more likely. Hey, most people don’t want to work and do their job, I don’t blame them for not wanting to do the math to bring back a class’s previously existing functionality, I’d just expect them to do it anyway cause that’s how jobs work. Whether you like it or not, you do it cause it’s your job. If you really don’t like it you leave.
Again, don’t blame you for taking the lazy route blizz, I do the same thing at my job sometimes. Only problem is, now I’m being affected by it. It’s fine that you were lazy just, could you maybe do some math now?
People play games to have fun. Being forced into choices you don’t want to make, that’s what work is for. At least with work, you’re being paid to do what you don’t want to do, not paying someone else. So please do the math now, I know you don’t want to but it is the job. Or maybe you could remove some other weapon types from other classes if things get too hard. Heck, why don’t you just make all classes weaponless, that aught’a make things easier for ya.
Also, I can do math if you’re looking for new employees.
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Correct.
Frostmourne was broken and they turned it into 2 littler ones, like Jamie’s sword on GoT.
Why they didn’t reforge it like narsasil(lotr), idk.maybe because it was a cursed blade when it was whole?
![:man_shrugging:](https://d38bqls1q93fod.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/man_shrugging.png?v=6" ":man_shrugging:")
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Not sure if you’re in favor of 2H frost DK or just trolling but whether a 2H frost DK should exist has nothing to do with Frostmourne other than the simple fact it was a 2H weapon.
Each class has a set of weapons it can use. For DK, a 2H weapon is one of them. Frostmourne or not, the class was made with 2H specialization, you could also initially play as a 2H wielding frost DK, makes no sense to remove that functionality as wielding a 2H weapon is one of the class’s specialties.
What the lore character Arthus did or didn’t do with Frostmourne has nothing to do with whether a frost DK should use a 2H sword. Arthus is able to wield a 2H in one hand, Arthus is an NPC that can’t really be compared to what an average DK’s experience should be.
That being said, I’m all for things lining up and making sense but I don’t expect what a raid boss can do to exactly translate into what a player should be able to do.
I just don’t want things to get too far off topic when speaking in terms of lore and who held what and how. The facts are DKs can wield 2H weapons, always have been able to. The fact Arthus at least had a 2H weapon, jives with this idea. The fact he did it with one hand is unique to him and doesn’t necessarily need to be translated to his DK followers.
Again, he’s the Lich KING, he should be doing something a little different. The fact though he didn’t teach us how to use a 2H weapon or that we can’t use one when we simply switch specs breaks the fantasy more than anything.
How in the heck are you given power by the Lich King himself, who wields a 2H weapon, and is fully within your characters ability to do so, but you can’t do it when you switch specs? lol… I guess a DK isn’t strong enough to hold it in frost? Does this make a paladin stronger then? How come he can swing one around and I can’t? Lich King, more power please!! I think the power he gave me must have ran out since WOTLK, it was a few expansions ago.
Now that actually makes sense as to why we can’t use 2H anymore lol. We killed him and now can’t hold the big sword no more lol. That and blizz be lazy.
As broken as the lore can be too, it’s hard to exactly line up what has been done lore wise with how an individual player’s experience should be. Regardless though, if your class can equip a certain weapon, makes no sense you can’t use it in another spec.
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Then you didn’t play Arms and you should stop talking now. Overpower was BATTLE STANCE only, and WW was BESERKER STANCE only, and you named them both as being part of Arms rotation and said Arms NEVER needed to change stances. It’s obvious you’re talking out your rectum and have no idea how Arms was really played.
Also, Heroic Strike core rotation once you had good gear, Hamstring core rotation (what you spammed aka filler, battle or bersk), Rend also was core rotation (battle, Def stance), Sweeping Strike, demoralizing shout, Sunder, Thunderclap (battle), cleave, Charge used often (battle) , Intercept used often (bersk) Bloodrage, battle shout (2 min Cd), Berserker Rage used often (bersk 30 sec cd), Pummel (used often), Retaliation not often (Battle 30 min cd), Recklessness not often (Beserk 30 min cd). There, now we are starting to actually see most of the things warriors used and most of them were used frequently.
You’re fake news basically and you proved it by not having a clue about the most basic parts of how Arms worked, I think this conversation is over now.
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/cast raise post…
Because 2h Frost needs to come back! NO! Not just as a cosmetic option, but the true blue, old school, 2h Frost Obliterate damage. @Blizzard… Please Unneuter us!!! #TwoHandedFrostForLife !
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not having a 2h option for frost simply makes no sense whatsoever for a death knight, period. it just doesn’t. i didn’t switch to DK from mage at WotLK because it was fad of the month. I switched because of the utterly awesome and iconic visage of Arthas in the trailer, clad in black and dread with a two handed sword, ice colder than the heart of dead winter emanating from his very presence. death knights should -never- have had dual wield in the first place. never. it’s anathema to everything core to the class and the lore around it. rogues, fury warriors, hunters, shamans, hell even monks make more sense with dual wield than a death knight.
2h swords, axes, maces, and my personal favorite during wrath at one point was a spear. i just loved the combat animations for polearms back then. i have to use whatever functions best for my spec, but dual wield should never have been used with death knights, ever.
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Anytime I the first two sentences read, make so and so great again, I know this person’s idea is bad.
Two hand frost can stay dead.
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Triggered Monk tears. Nom nom
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“It just doesn’t,” is not a reason. Frost has been built on a dual-wield fantasy since day one. The fact that people want to throw that away because of their own head-canon is what truly makes no sense. It’s a selfish tantrum, and nothing more.
You’ll be happy to hear that Unholy, the spec that Arthas embodied the most, is still solidly a two-handed spec.
Since what you really seem to want is appearance, given that Arthas didn’t really use Frost spells all that often, you can still achieve this with transmog as Unholy - which is great, because then you’re matching his spell usage/fighting style and outward appearance. You can get the whole package.
There’s no basis to this claim. The majority of the Death Knight themes and lore, especially that of Frost and Blood, were created for Wrath. And the writers and developers created the Death Knight with dual-wielding as a part of them. This decision was made over a decade ago. Deal with it.