No i dont think if it were that easy that they would have done it, The game has become a theme park and blizzard really couldnt care less what the playerbase wants, they dont want to hire the extra man to go into the development of the 2 handed spec theyre fine with just removing the agency to do so and leaving it at that.
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So you genuinely think that a multi-million dollar company is actively sticking it to the players they are trying to get to play their game. Because they are absolutely, without a doubt, purposefully going against an easy, and more profitable solution just for the sake of it. Right. That sure makes the most sense.
I also love that you think that adding 2H Frost would require hiring an extra person. I mean, it’s only so simple and easy that it requires a whole other developer to make this single sub-spec work. It’s like you just made the entire case for why the sub-spec concept doesn’t work, and why they were removed from all classes.
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2h Frost Death Knight is my favorite class. Ever since they took it away I have been class switching trying to find my way again but I don’t like any other class as much as 2h Frost Death Knight. I feel forced to find another class to play but none of the other classes make me happy. BRING 2H FROST DEATH KNIGHT BACK!
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This will be my last reply to Kelliste because It has become a chore having to reply to someone so single-minded and somehow extremely irresolute when i’d rather be discussing ways we can bring back two-handed frost without toxic deterrence.
“You clearly haven’t read anything…”
- Wrong i’ve read everything you’ve said and I regret it deeply.
“The thing that you guys clearly don’t understand is…”
- You can just say “Everyone is wrong and i’m right because…” next time.
“…You think there are only 2 sides to this, pro or anti 2h”
- Correct that’s literally the entire point of this thread. We are pro 2-hander. Try to keep up.
“You also do know that there is a small number of Frost Dk’s compared to other classes right?”
- Correct, but that doesn’t invalidate our stance on 2-handed frost.
You boast and bluster alot but no comment you’ve said in this thread has actually stemmed from any intelligent thinking, just harrassment towards anyone who won’t agree with you, dated information or just general trolling. Bye-bye xoxo.
Also thank you to those who are in this thread supporting the Two-Handed cause and welcoming logical and respectful disscusions without trying to derail or shame others for their preferred playstyle.
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I take it you are talking about me? I know that it’s easy to bring 2h back, I have been stating that for a long time. It wouldn’t be 100% perfect of course, but the only real thing you can do is set a different set of standards for 2h for let’s say the chance at km procs which can widely vary since it is based on crit.
I just think changing the spec should be changed and I think it’s a complete design failure. I really think that’s the core of the entire issue and not just what weapon you are using. I mean people want to change the playstyle for the sake of 2h so it should be pretty evident that people don’t like the playstyle, or even the fact that there are so few frost dk’s to begin with. There were a lot more in Legion than there are now so it can’t really be a weapon choice problem.
That can make it a glyph but again it should be apparent as well that people don’t want that. Though I would say those people think the playstyle should stay the same with just a visual change. Or they don’t want to get 2 1h weapons because they are lazy or whatever else.
I don’t like the playstyle. I also think it’s not really fair to use the entire “you don’t play so your points are invalid” argument. I haven’t gotten to 60 on classic and probably never will but I know the debuff limit makes it so you can’t play your class to its fullest and I wouldn’t like raiding and just spamming shadow bolts and applying my assigned curse. People can recognize problems and not have to play the game. I don’t play the game yet I know razorice on the main hand weapon so that a certain ability applies the debuff to multiple enemies, certain people playing the game don’t know that though.
It’s actually a little bit of both. Just like something can be easy to play but hard to master. It would be simple to just make certain specifications on abilities for when you are using one weapon set over the other. The issue is balance. Km procs for example, how much of a higher chance do you give to 2h to compensate for fewer attacks? What happens when you get more crit and haste?
It’s a simple solution if you don’t care about balance. Or just make it a glyph and tell people to live with it.
Flagged.
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I was specifically responding to the idea that it only takes a few minor tweaks to add the whole thing back in as it was.
The balancing implications of that requires way more math than people ever seem to realise, and it just doesn’t make sense to devote that many resources to constantly making sure that this balance is kept. Especially so because it is also incredibly difficult to strike a balance for both the short term, and the long term - we already see how many tweaks and adjustments are needed each patch (not to mention hotfixes) to keep things similar enough when they introduce new gear, bonuses, traits, etc., and players are often unhappy with that as it is. And now some players want to add a hefty pre-requisite to work out before all of that, and it massively complicates the normal balancing as well? It’s just not in the company’s best interest to bother with it, and even less so when it wasn’t a core design or spec feature. The sub-spec concept was rightfully thrown out.
I completely agree with this sentiment, though I don’t support it as a solution, even though some 2H Frost supporters are fine with this angle. I don’t think it’s a fair solution for a number of reasons; if they’re going to add it back, it needs to be done right, fully functional on its own, and without the sub-spec issues. I don’t think it’s fair to players to inherently punish them for a preference if they’re going to actually support the design, nor do I think that players would stand for that for very long. A portion of the 2H Frost crowd may in a bargaining stage for now, but if they did get it back, they would just as quickly demand that it was competitive. These forums have already gone through the years of unhappy players complaining that it wasn’t up to snuff for its tenure, not understanding why they couldn’t get accepted to groups, etc. It’s not fair to intentionally put them back in that situation where they would, knowingly or not, be shooting themselves in the foot to play what they want.
This is why I would support the idea of a whole separate spec for a two-handed playstyle, there just needs to be enough of a theme or identity to make that work. But, there’s not enough to make 2H Frost specifically a separate spec - the entire 2H Frost identity is “Obliterate hits hard,” and you can’t make a whole new spec out of just that. While I don’t think it’s likely that we’re getting some kind of Fire spec as of now (not nearly enough information), if they were to add one it may be the best solution to make that into a slow two-handed playstyle - but, again, that demands enough of a theme, and by extension story, to make that work. It may happen, it may not. Time will tell if all this speculation hits the mark, or is way off base.
They can go the glyph or mog allowance route, but that’s only if they’re willing to open that can of worms with all the classes, and not let Frost alone be a special case, or else there would be a group of Shaman players absolutely rioting. I have nothing against this path, but I personally don’t think Blizzard will do it.
Well,
with the new DKs comming soon it seems like there are 4 Starter 2 handers - the two of note is the Freezing sword and the Blazing sword.
I suspect We get something like Corpse Fire - or Pyre spec which will be fire themed 2 handed frost.
If they do I hope we have a talent called “Ashen verdict”
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Ashen Verdict is one of the coolest titles in the game. 
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“We brought back 2h Frost but it’s not frost anymore”
Can these people f_cking stop, please?
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I agree that you arent going to make everyone happy and this thread is a perfect example of this. Some just want a glyph, but that isnt good enough for others.
But lets say you do create a 4th spec for 2h frost… what about tank frost? Tank unholy? Blood DPS? And then if you give all those back what about meta demonology locks? Dark Apotheosis? Single Minded Fury Warriors? Gladiator stance? 2h Enhancement? and so many more. You would have to create specs for all of that for the sake of balance.
Then if you look at the specs each spec recently has its own set of damaging abilities without hardly any overlap. So what would the abilities be for these new specs? It just gets to be a bigger and bigger issue.
You do kind of have to choose if you want choice or balance though. There really isnt much of a way around it, even if you split the specs one will be better.
Choice I would say is the most important. A spec is going to play how it was intended unless someone finds some funky stuff going on like what happened with DW unholy that lasted maybe a week before it was fixed since it wasnt how the ability was supposed to work.
I dont like the playstyle of frost, at all. Despite not playing since Dec, I have played it unlike what people want to make it sound like, and you can tell from the basics if you like something or not. I have heard however that you can go Icecap and get close to BoS dps levels with certain azerite traits and so on, which I would probably like.
Overall it isnt a simple solution now if you care about balance. If you dont care you can go wild. Players care about balance though so it just isnt simple.
Sure i’ll bite. Kelliste couldnt play 2 handed frost dk. Couldnt understand that you needed 2 sets of gear if you until mid/end of WOD when versatility was your best friend anove haste or any other seconday stat. Kelliste didnt understand that a 2 handed dk in full 715 pvp gear could pull 4th-7th place in a 25 man raid because dw was the only way a frost dk was ever MEANT to be played. Give it up man seriously. We used to have a choice. We want it back. Thats what this discussion is about. Big obliterate crits were happening in mop and cata too. 90k crits in dragon soul with diseases up was a thing. Even running unholy presence was big for a while. Armor potions for damage boost cmon man!!! You keep attacking and justifying dw when the fact is it sucks! It used to be a choice. And either sub spec was fine until legion removed 2 hand and this dw…thing that we have now is a joke. BOS is also a joke. Go back to where frost was in wod or earlier expansions but my God man please stop trying to defend this crap we have now. Peace 
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Why do none of you actually read my posts and create some straw man argument that has nothing to do with what I said? Why do you guys think there is no middle ground and it’s not just you are either a 2h supporter or DW supporter? Why do you guys constantly repeat the things I have said like it’s some kind of gotcha moment.
You have provided 0 to this discussion.
Ahh but you have added yet another 0. Actually 2 zeros because you DW and thats the only viable zero output for a zero spec 
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Ok? You don’t like DW go play your warrior or another 2h spec.
Your off-hand doesn’t even have a Rune.
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You know you’re definitely in the right when you have to go four days back to take a quote out of context, and make an Armory attack out of it.
The weapon isn’t socketed either. It’s almost like they stopped playing shortly after obtaining the weapon. Isn’t that just a mind-blowing concept? I mean, who would ever slowly stop putting effort into a game as they decided to stop playing?
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Do I need to explain to you in one easy sentence how the world works?
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I will fill you onto something of what I was doing until my time ran out and I stopped playing.
As you can see, most gear is from the first Warfront ever and I was going through getting gear on all of my characters because I was done with BFA at the very least. 340 should be more than enough for the next expansion in terms of leveling. If you want to go through it I dont even have good Azerite traits, no enchants even though I have an enchanter, no gems or anything else on any characters plus I was playing my Fury warrior most of the time spent playing because I dont like the Frost playstyle like I have said multiple times.
I would get to 120 in maybe a few hours during the Warfront window and get geared up in an afternoon. I wouldnt have to do a single dungeon to get into it and would play Blood as well, as I would play Prot Pally, Prot or Fury Warrior, Demo lock to try out the changes.
At this point what you flagged me for you are guilty of since you, and the other 2 that are just piling on with each other are just harassing at this point. But unlike you, I really dont care because they lack any basis.
It also took you forever to type out that one sentence response. By the time I have written this, the system has shown that you have been typing a response, posted that one sentence that doesnt do anything, and attempted to write a few others.
If it is that hard to come up with a response to people then I would say give it a rest. You and the other 2 are not making yourselves look good other than just being DW hating players because you really dont understand that right now, its not a DW thing but a bad class design thing and you dont know how to distinguish between the 2.
I am happy that I was proven right and that not all the data was datamined since not all the information was put on the PTR yet and guess what, they still arent done.