So now the important question is, how are you going to adjust it so that Normal and AOTC guilds stop being invalidated by the easy, spammable, repeatability of M+ loot?
26 Likes
Can’t yall just raid because you want to raid?
126 Likes
Gotta justify raids somehow.
7 Likes
Nope, it was always the loot! I still remember seeing T2 and instantly wanting to raid for it.
I was always more about the look of tier sets though, and the more recent ones just don’t interest me. I think it’s the lack of class identity ever since they change them to look more like the raid they are from and not about the classes.
16 Likes
Easy, make raid drop 7-8 loot, have an upgrade system and tokens to buy a couple of items from a vendor.
57 Likes
Normal has its own transmog sets and weapon colors already though.
1 Like
If a group is stuck on an encounter or having a few difficulties with it and know that it would be a bit easier with easy to get, additional Mythic gear from M+… it puts pressure on the group to do M+. That’s easy kitchen table psychology and totally makes sense.
Especially for AotC groups it’s the best way to make encounters much easier when they have easy access to Mythic gear - gear they wouldn’t ever see otherwise.
6 Likes
It was kind of just a jab at the newer armors, while more advanced with 3D parts and what not, feel lacking in identity. When one of the most loved tier sets in Legion were the T6 remakes, I was a little hopeful we might see a return of flashier sets based off of the classes rather than the zones.
The only reason I really raided was to have something to do as a guild. Now that I lack a guild I stopped raiding.
2 Likes
This is true. But you can farm heroic, and mythic trash loot groups. And do dungeons, or buy boes off the auction house, or practice your rotation on a dummy and fully master your rotation.
Normal mode is flex mode which was designed for casual/family guilds. Which is easily fixed by playing heroic, and doing harder modes for better loot.
honestly just put m+ in a vacuum so people stop complaining and it doesn’t effect us whatsoever. anyone who pushes m+ to a high level will be in dungeon bis anyway.
oh yeah and give increased rewards for like 20+ keys. at least from the vault. doesn’t have to be gear, but something. sheesh man i’d take some gold for doing 20s from the vault lol wouldn’t have to boost as much
3 Likes
We did, for years.
But ever since Nighthold, Blizzard assumes everyone has unlimited quantities of maxxed out M+ gear, and tunes the raids accordingly.
If Blizzard tuned the raids solely around the rewards you can get from the raids themselves, like they used to, we wouldn’t have a problem. But they don’t, because M+ warps everything.
35 Likes
Last tier, +20 keys were about the same as Heroic raiding. The rewards from M+ are far too generous already, considering its lack of difficulty.
4 Likes
But M+ often gives much higher gear than Heroic and is far less time consuming. Mythic trash loot groups also are extremely time consuming considering the strong RNG aspect. Just doing M+ is much more effective.
Sure, but every player has a skill cap and often there isn’t much to be gained from more practise. Better gear, more gems etc. are then the more easy and reliable way of getting to more DPS/heal/whatever or even the key to have more survivability during boss mechanics.
It all boils down to “M+ loot is too easy and too good”; better than other options.
3 Likes
bro i just want some gold for consumables so i dont need to boost people lol m+ is ruff gold wise
complete a +20 key get some $$$$$ in ur vault. sounds legit to me
No, I think it’s them trying to tune around world first guilds, which is why sof was such a failure. They’re supposed to be doing away with that now.
4 Likes
And now you’ll have people crying that m+ is too good at making gold and raid, world quests, pvp, pet battles should also provide 10k gold per clear.
Idk people seem to clear normal and heroic pretty fast. And usually tuned around base mythic 0 gear. World first raiders farm and funnel gear through raids.
Then ilvl gets more accessible as the season goes on. Many bis pieces come from mythic raids to do top end mythic dungeons too. And dungeons always were done to get ready for raiding.
idc if ppl complain because i still have that gold tho 
2 Likes
It wasn’t RWF, it was M+. Just look at the timing.
M+ first appeared at the start of Legion, when Emerald Nightmare was the 1st raid. People steamrolled Emerald Nightmare because somehow it never occurred to Blizzard that people would do Mythic+ AND raid. They figured the player populations would be mutually exclusive and raiders would never touch M+.
Instead, everybody walked into Emerald Nightmare already overgearing it thanks to M+ and steamrolled it.
Blizzard had egg all over their face and overtuned Nighthold as a result. At the time, it was frequently commented that - unlike every raid that preceded it - Nighthold didn’t get any easier once you had it on farm. That’s because once you beat it, you already had gear from M+; the gearing was already done before you finished the raid.
8 Likes
Callings have been worth a decent amount. It’s been enough to keep my Transmog addiction going 
1 Like