It is Time to Ban WoW Addons

[Redhotbunny-whisperwind]

Is not even sun yet

[Qamaits-darrowmere (Qamaits)]

You’re the one that keeps moving the goal posts. First, you wanted to ban addons because they were hurting the game in some amorphous way you couldn’t articulate. Then it was because they played the game for you. Seondly, you wanted them banned because it was too hard or inconvenient to download them. Then it was because of addon managers. When that was shot down you moved on to the most people argument.

Your logic is flawed and keeps getting more flawed the farther down this rabbit hole you go. Just admit you don’t want people using addons because you don’t want to and don’t want others to have some ill-defined advantage that only exists in your head.

[Anhanrundek-altar-of-storms]

@Clasm-stormrage

it’s not optional when they literally design encounters around the expectations that users have certain addons by default.

SO EYEROLL THAT.

BAN - THEM - ALL!

lmao.
“I dont like it so BAN it”

not gonna happen so you’ll have to deal with it.

[Bilbodo-malorne]

Arena lan tourneys were played with no addons. Highest level players. Clean up the atrocious mess that is addons.

[Dracen-moon-guard]

I wouldn’t trust Blizzard to keep up with “addons” built into their base game any more than I would trust them to fully test and ensure there are no bugs in their newest patches before releasing them.

[Beki-dalaran]

@Qamaits-darrowmere

You’re the one that keeps moving the goal posts. First, you wanted to ban addons because they were hurting the game in some amorphous way you couldn’t articulate. Then it was because they played the game for you. Seondly, you wanted them banned because it was too hard or inconvenient to download them. Then it was because of addon managers. When that was shot down you moved on to the most people argument.

Your logic is flawed and keeps getting more flawed the farther down this rabbit hole you go. Just admit you don’t want people using addons because you don’t want to and don’t want others to have some ill-defined advantage that only exists in your head.

OK, that is a fine opinion

[Anhanrundek-altar-of-storms]

@Qamaits-darrowmere

Seondly, you wanted them banned because it was too hard or inconvenient to download them.

That was the joke that made me giggle out loud.
If devs are taking them into account make the game ‘harder’ to compensate, shame on the devs.
But their being anything more complex than a first grade education to figure out is just a big fib. lol.

download > open file > drag file to addons folder.

Jesus marge, thats nail breaking lmao

[Dispelled-garona]

@Cyous-area-52

Oh boy, this will be good. Let’s teach you how to prevent tunnel vision so you can actually see what’s going on.

@Dispelled-garona

Most trash with melee frontals have a ~1sec cast time and the only telegraph is hoping you see that particular mobs cast bar. This is just common knowledge.

• Not an acceptable answer. You need to give me a spell to look at.

…Everything you listed has multiple telegraphs, including game sounds, but I assume you have those muted.

First of all, no one owes you anything. I certainly don’t owe it to you to elaborate on my explanations to a degree that you feel “satisfied with the explanation.”

From your achievements, it looks like you stop at about KSM (last season, and decided not to do it this season?). Obviously, if your experience is just running trivial content, things are going to die fast enough that you can turn your brain off and play just fine without addons. That’s great for you and I hope you’re happy with your in game addon-free experience, that’s not how it is for everyone.

When you start running higher difficulties, the things that you describe as “damage isn’t even deadly” or “stand in melee (to counter a harpoon pulling you into another mob’s 1-shot mechanic, in a pack that has fixates)”, or “just don’t pull those packs together at the same time” you’ll discover that most of your advice and dismissals seem amateurish.

Just in case you forgot or more likely, had chosen not to read, the comment chain that you chose to reply to began with a guy suggesting we didn’t need DBM/BW because we could just use the in-game stopwatch and I made the counter point that there are simply many things that are not telegraphed or occur in groups such that trying to replace DBM/BW with a stopwatch wouldn’t be practical.

If you’re on Team “stopwatch is all people need”, hey, be my guest, we’re clearly playing different games.

Does anyone not playing a melee on a serious difficulty actually think the 1sec uninterruptable cast bar on NL Breakers is an adequate telegraph for a 1-shot mechanic?

When we pull the 3x Titan orb pull in HoI (or the 4x Titan orb pull for the multi-pack pull before the first boss), the cast bars are a “telegraph”, sure. But they do not tell you “you are targeted by this cast.” If that cast goes off on a player without a defensive ready, they’re dead, maybe even with a defensive if they are targeted by more than one.

Should they, what, manually target every titan orb every single cast to see if they are the one the orb is about to shoot?

[Beki-dalaran]

@Cåndyxo-stormrage

I don’t trust blizzard to make nice looking functional raid/party/target/etc frames. They have tried and failed multiple times.

Maybe because they don’t need to? because people who are unhappy with it will use 3rd party addon anyway? And people who are happy with it, will use the default UI anyway?

[Anhanrundek-altar-of-storms]

@Dracen-moon-guard

I wouldn’t trust Blizzard to keep up with “addons” built into their base game any more than I would trust them to fully test and ensure there are no bugs in their newest patches before releasing them.

Look how long it took to do something as simple as that little “youve got mail” icon done right on the login page. lol.
I dont like having to rely on third parties either, but blizzard isnt renowned for keeping up with things they dont consider top priority…and even then…

[Shocckington-malganis]

1. This competition would have happened with or without add-ons, and in fact did happen at the early start of it all. They used spreadsheets and etc. to do the work that addons do currently, it’s just add-ons streamline the process now. The other reason why hardcore’s quit was due to blizzard making Shadowlands raids a full poo show with over tuning the instances and all the gear changes they made. Followed by the covenant system that wasn’t properly changed until halfway through the expansion which burnt a lot of players out.

2. It’s easy to balme add-ons but hard to admit that trying to come up with creative ideas that haven’t been done before. In a game as old as WoW is really hard to do, so their balme shifting on add-ons over admitting that it’s hard not to have to repeat the same mechanics over and over again. Given raiding is the end all be method of gearing, meaning that making very complicated fights that takes a month or two to clear like it did in classic. Clashes with the faster paced release schedule that they follow now meaning that they have to dumb things down like they did with neltharion and his class call out mechanic. As they couldn’t implement it correctly and didn’t have enough time to properly implement it due to the schedule they had to follow.

3. It’s good that blizzard is implementing basic elements into the game, should have been done years ago. This point I agree with to an extent given I do agree some things should be implemented to be baseline with the game. Yet banning things like DBM and WA’s is not a good idea and should be left alone, and in fact blizzard supports DBM and has already weakend the power WA’s have.

4. You don’t have to do this necessarily if you just copy your WTF folder, it snapshots your UI and so forth and let’s you keep it backed up, or copy it to any new system you may get. Heck, and I did this when I built my new system, you can move the entire game to a USB or hard drive and then transfer it to the new hard drive. Third party add-on sites I do agree are a mess, pretty much a product of companies currently. In which I do wish blizzard had their own site that creator’s could upload to and cut out the third party aspect, buts it’s not so horrendous that it’s killing the game.

5. It isn’t for the greater good of the game and only aims to satisfy the ones that think add-ons are the evil of the game when their simply not.

While I get that addons certainly do have an impact on the game, be it good or bad, the arguments you made would have happened with or without add-ons. In which the argument where add-ons don’t exist would pin the blame on some other aspect of the game, over just simply realizing that it’s not a single issue, but a multitude of smaller issues that have compounded into a bigger one, and is being pinned on add-ons to try and simply the reason why things are the way they are.

[Qamaits-darrowmere (Qamaits)]

At this point I’m thinking the whole reason for this thread is the OP got declined from an M+ or mythic raid because of their anti-addon stance and the RL didn’t want the drama.

[Cåndyxo-stormrage]

So then why are you advocating to rid addons? if people will use them or not depending on how they feel whats the point of this thread?

[Anhanrundek-altar-of-storms]

@Qamaits-darrowmere

At this point I’m thinking the whole reason for this thread is the OP got declined from an M+ or mythic raid because of their anti-addon stance and the RL didn’t want the drama.

There nearly always is some personal reason they storm in here demanding blizzard take our toys away.
Id be inclined to agree with your assessment.

edit…thread muted.
aint worthy of the time wasted

[Merpish-sargeras]

@Beki-dalaran

Blizzard can continue the current path, and make WoW more and more into a game of 3rd party websites, addons and sims. It just needs to accept the fact that it will continue decline and not attract new players.

None of this has any impact on the new player experience. New players learn about addons and either download them or don’t. Not a single addon is required to play this game.

[Gnr-darkspear]

I think that it wouldn’t be a completely terrible idea to scale back SOME addons, if that went hand-in-hand with a guaranteed reduction in difficulty/encounter complexity.

But I certainly don’t think that we need to be limited to the stock UI. I’d even go as far as to say that UI customization is one of the things that makes this game great.

As a healer, I’ve used the same raid-frames addon since vanilla (Healbot), and I have zero desire to try to replicate that functionality with the stock UI. Having that removed might even be enough to make me quit the game, because switching over to the stock UI for something that has been so core to the way I’ve played the game for almost 2 decades would be almost like being forced to learn a new game.

And there are plenty of other addons that, while technically giving a slight advantage, are still very benign. I mainly use weakauras for things like notifying me when I have a clearcast proc, when I’m running low on mana, or when my cooldowns are up. Maybe that’s giving me a small advantage but it’s all stuff I’ve been doing for 15+ years. I really don’t see any legit reason why they need to be removed.

[Selura-area-52]

@Mythosaur-frostwolf

dbm is funny it player say it plays the game for you no it dont.

Funny thing about DBM. While it doesn’t physically play the game for you; it does change how information is presented to you making you make better choices (Example: stand in stupid or get out of stupid. - DBM will tell you to get out of it and yet people still fail). There have been add-ons that literally been banned because while not physically playing (wait there where) made the encounters so easy by drawing on the in-game screen what to do and where to go (again not physically playing but visually telling you the player get out of stupid by moving here).

I still think add-ons have a place but not for poorly designed game engines and or how information is presented to the player. I do think players need to pay attention more (audio and visual cues) than seeing how high they can get on a meter. But that is going to be a thing of the past because of generational differences between players.

[Cyous-area-52]

@Dispelled-garona

From your achievements, it looks like you stop at about KSM.

Shame, if you saw my FOS’s you’d see there was a pretty long stretch of time where I was pretty high up in the rankings for progression. Even wrote many guides and helped many RWF/MDI-level players over the years. I play casually these days because thats where I have fun. And if you’re familar with M+, you’d know we’re doing the same dungeons, and they have the same spell effects.

You seem to be mistaken though, the higher you go, the more optimized people become. AddOns help optimize many things, ofc. But in M+ isn’t a PVP mode, you’re only challenging the dungeon with your group. Let’s say only 3% of players get their portals/20’s each season. Do you really want to “ban addons” just because a dedicated subset of players utilizes them to achieve their personal goals?

@Dispelled-garona

Does anyone not playing a melee on a serious difficulty actually think the 1sec uninterruptable cast bar on NL Breakers is an adequate telegraph for a 1-shot mechanic?

Here’s a tip. Just move until it casts the spell. If you’re gonna waste 5sec, you might as well not waste 5sec + the run back. When I play my priest, I’m eating a burrito in one hand and casting healing spells with my cheetoh-dusted mouse on the other. It’s really not that hard to figure out how to avoid those Avalanches. When I play my warrior, im just moving anyways, and not standing in front of the enemy.

That’s a game knowledge issue though. You know that spell is coming, clearly. Take extra measures to avoid it if you know you can’t dodge it by reaction only.

@Dispelled-garona

If you’re on Team “stopwatch is all people need”, hey, be my guest, we’re clearly playing different games.

Yeah, DBM/BigWigs are just fancy clocks. Same with most WeakAuras.

@Dispelled-garona

When we pull the 3x Titan orb pull in HoI (or the 4x Titan orb pull for the multi-pack pull before the first boss), the cast bars are a “telegraph”, sure. But they do not tell you “you are targeted by this cast.” If that cast goes off on a player without a defensive ready, they’re dead, maybe even with a defensive if they are targeted by more than one.

That’s your decision to pull multiple packs. Sure, the clutter can be rough when you pull a bunch. But that still isn’t a lack of a telegraph.

[Bravik-argent-dawn]

@Beki-dalaran

Why do you even troll people’s thread if you don’t even read anything?

It’s par for the course here, unfortunately.

[Aspectofhug-moon-guard]

I’m not at all against addons but designing a fight with addons as the focus is dumb. You have to get an addon to play the game isn’t good. It’s like Destiny requiring you to use Discord to form a raid group. Mal’ganis and Jailer were both demanding you use addons, both those fights are worse because of it. Overly complex =/= fun