Are you sure they never buy with extra cash?
This is hogwash.
PTW is a literal commerce model of games.
See Diablo Imortal and other browser games like Grepolis.
It’s a literal transaction model.
all im sayin is u can consider it p2w and it’s fine but using the top players as an example might actually be the worst example because again, they’re not paying for anything other than a puzzle piece.
I’ve met guys like that. My old boyfriend was commissioner of a Rotisserie team back in the 90s and he not only knew who was in the majors but who was in the minors as well because every day he had to do the transactions for his league.
Thing is, those guys knew who won their Rotisserie league going back years, not sure if they knew who won the actually World Series championship.
" … Oh you mean the real league yeah, let’s see, I think it was the Twins …"
Who told you that I need them? They need me but honestly, i dont need them. I could accomplish stuffs byvmyself especially now that there is this called… Group Finder.
Its the same anyway, the sale money ultimately comes from someone buying tokens right. Carries would not really be an issue if they didn’t sell gold altho then it would be sold illicitly anyway
yea i dont think the top players are the best example you could use in this argument like surely there’s a better example
It is sold illicitly. Blizzard just doesn’t get a cut. They want that cut. And they will sell the soul of the game away to get it.
P2W is also a term that’s been used to describe a model of games where you just buy power, not specifically to “win” or to buy things that cannot reasonably be obtained by a non-paying player in-game.
Yes those games exist, obviously, but that’s not the sole definition of that that term has been used for.
As I said a while back in the thread, there isn’t actually one universally agreed upon definition of what “Pay to Win” means in gaming. There’s just some people on both sides of the argument who want to argue their personal definition is the “real one”(not saying you specifically, but it happens a lot in these discussions).
What power are you buying… if you are on par or have less power than everyone else who didn’t spend money?
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In my world … time > money. A few thousand bucks on a hobby … easy. Spending 3 hours a day farming … not gonna happen. I have cuddles to get
now that im thinking about it, someone could buy full mythic boes and a full clean ksm carry and i think my gear would still be better objectively LOL
actually ill even throw in an aotc carry and a mythic funnel
(btw this would be thousands of dollars)
Power is power.
I said buying power, not “buying more power than what any other player can get”. If I had meant that, I’d have said that.
Being able to buy a bunch of ilvl 304 gear is buying power that “everyone else” most certainly does not have.
Power is relevant to something.
By your own logic / definition - any item in the blizzard store including cosmetic items and mounts could be pay to win
That’s an extremely broad definition.
One which I don’t think is correct otherwise every game with a store is pay to win.
honestly there’s a huge misconception on how expensive it truly is to get a full boosted ksm carry on BOTH sides and how often this player (out of this low percentage that would actually do it) would get into your keys / take your spot
like u can argue around realism but nobody does this unless ur willing to fork out a thousand dollars.
And even someone who did this… doesn’t even guarantee they take your spot / key.
Which means they are still behind you.
And you’re thousand of dollars richer.
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u can argue theory all day long but at the end of the day nobody is doing this. people are buying 1 single 15 a week generally for their vault. they don’t pay for omega ksm carries.
Must respect to other countries … but … a thousand bucks … is like 1/3 of a weeks pay net
yes, but again, this is just arguing something random. people don’t do this. like they don’t
sure you have the small % that does, but this small % of players who do you probably won’t interact with ever
Power is relevant to the performance of your character.
Cosmetics that do not have stats are not power.
As people have pointed out, the world first guilds don’t spend tens of millions of gold every tier buying up BoEs simply because they think the gear is pretty. They do it because it gives them an advantage in the world first race against other people who are also spending tens of millions of gold.
and these are the people at the top. The people who are quite literally trying to win before any other player in the world wins.
Extra gear doesn’t actually do much for the performance of your character unless your playing cutting edge stuff (actual playing - not boosting)
And if your playing cutting edge stuff…. you’re not spending money on gear.