Is the reason WoW is so bad now that Blizzard refuses to pay their employees fair wages?

[Ziryus-doomhammer (Ziryus)]

@Bonerover-stormreaver

It’s not just me mate. Why is a 15 year old version of the game more popular?

Have subscribers been going up for Retail?

I would love to see play rates between retail and classic.

Last time blizzard posted retail sub rates which was long before classic, it was at sub 3 million?

I would love to see current sub rates, with a break down of people playing mainly classic, mainly retail, or both.

[Bonerover-stormreaver]

@Ziryus-doomhammer

I would love to see play rates between retail and classic.

They’re scared to release it. They don’t want to admin that Classic is more popular then Retail.

Although just the transparency would be cool.

[Delimicus-heartseeker]

There’s plenty of evidence that retail is more popular.

The retail forums have far more posts.
The retail WoW reddit has more than double the number of people online right now.
The retail forums on mmo-champion are far more popular.
Retail addons have roughly twice the number of downloads each time a version update is released. Even with AQ launching, DBM has half the downloads for the most recent Classic version compared to the most recent Retail version, despite the last retail content patch releasing many months ago.

[Bonerover-stormreaver]

I mean those are all good measurements but nothing can say for sure.

I’ve already linked proof of them saying player based doubled. Which means Classic at least got 50/50 just from new subscribers assumingly.

https://venturebeat.com/2019/11/07/world-of-warcaft-classic-drove-subscriptions-to-record-growth-for-a-quarter/

Here’s another link. Like I said, we can’t know unless Blizzard actually tells us.

I’m fairly certain raid logs are more popping on Classic too by the way.

[Delimicus-heartseeker]

That was almost a year ago, I’m using current metrics.

[Bonerover-stormreaver]

Use Warcraft logs.

Over 6million BWL parses recorded versus maybe 500,000 for Ny’alotha or w/e its called.

Classic players aren’t just parsing 20 times more either.

[Ziryus-doomhammer (Ziryus)]

@Bonerover-stormreaver

@Ziryus-doomhammer

I would love to see play rates between retail and classic.

They’re scared to release it. They don’t want to admin that Classic is more popular then Retail.

Although just the transparency would be cool.

Yeah, the problem is they have people like AA in senior positions who just refuse to admit that ideas like trying to kill flying were just bad.

[Delimicus-heartseeker]

Firstly, raiding is the only viable path of character progression for most people in Classic. In retail, there’s far more ways to play the game and progress your character. Raiding isn’t the end all be all in retail.

@Bonerover-stormreaver

Over 6million BWL parses recorded versus maybe 500,000 for Ny’alotha or w/e its called.

There’s 3,600 more guilds that have cleared Heroic Ny’alotha in the US/EU in retail than there is that have cleared BWL in Classic. Classic does have larger raid sizes so the number of players should be roughly the same.

Now when you add in LFR and Normal raiders, yeah, retail has more raiders too.

[Ziryus-doomhammer (Ziryus)]

But that doesn’t really do anything to change that classic is still very popular compared to retail and not just a small niche market.

[Bonerover-stormreaver]

@Delimicus-heartseeker

Firstly, raiding is the only viable path of character progression for most people in Classic. In retail, there’s far more ways to play the game and progress your character. Raiding isn’t the end all be all in retail.

@Bonerover-stormreaver

Classic players aren’t just parsing 20 times more either.

Not all people playing Classic raid either. There are people who just PvP and those who don’t care about gear too.

@Delimicus-heartseeker

There’s 3,600 more guilds that have cleared Heroic Ny’alotha in the US/EU in retail than there is that have cleared BWL in Classic.

Raid size is quite different my friend. Plus pugs are way more common on Classic.

@Delimicus-heartseeker

Now when you add in LFR and Normal raiders, yeah, retail has more raiders too.

You don’t know this.

@Ziryus-doomhammer

anything to change that classic is still very popular compared to retail and not just a small niche market.

Exactly. Its even bad to consider that Classic might be half as popular of what Retail is because again, Classic is 15 years old.

[Delimicus-heartseeker]

@Ziryus-doomhammer

But that doesn’t really do anything to change that classic is still very popular compared to retail

Except that Classic isn’t more popular than Retail.

[Bonerover-stormreaver]

@Delimicus-heartseeker

Except that Classic isn’t more popular than Retail.

You don’t know that lol.

It definitely could be, and more then likely is. I’ve posted two links now. Can you post one?

[Delimicus-heartseeker]

Classic is not more popular than Retail. I offered up a bevy of evidence, try not to let your confirmation bias sway you from the truth.

[Bonerover-stormreaver]

@Delimicus-heartseeker

Classic is not more popular than Retail.

Again, you don’t know.

@Delimicus-heartseeker

I offered up a bevy of evidence

I’ve offered better evidence. And sources. You have zero.

The Warcraft logs for BWL, is just in the past few weeks too. How long has Heroic Ny’alatho been out?

Unless you’re saying PvP and Mythic dungeons are over 15 times more popular then PvE raiding?

[Delimicus-heartseeker]

@Bonerover-stormreaver

I’ve offered better evidence.

I’ve offered current evidence, you offered up something from nearly a year ago.

Here’s the number of logs being uploaded right now:

Classic BWL and MC:

https://classic.warcraftlogs.com/zone/reports?zone=1002
https://classic.warcraftlogs.com/zone/reports?zone=1000

Ny’alotha:

https://www.warcraftlogs.com/zone/reports?zone=24

Explain to me why not a single Classic addon even comes close to the number of downloads when a new version is released compared to Retail.

[Bonerover-stormreaver]

@Delimicus-heartseeker

Explain to me why not a single Classic addon even comes close to the number of downloads when a new version is released compared to Retail.

Classic has a lot of people that don’t use addons. Or very few.

Again, lets use logs since that doesn’t require anything from a player other then attendance.

[Delimicus-heartseeker]

Conjecture, you have zero evidence for this claim.

[Bonerover-stormreaver]

Addons, Please do not allow them

Please in the spirit of Classic Vanilla WoW do not allow addons to be used. It will not be good in any way. Please keep it as close as possible to Classic as you can. Addons have their place here in present day WoW but not in the past. I want to experience Classic just as it was all those years ago. Clean. I know I can not prevent the aid of web sites like WoWHead but I would still like to see Classic as close as possible as it was back in the day. Please comment if you agree or if you disa…

[Ziryus-doomhammer (Ziryus)]

@Delimicus-heartseeker

@Ziryus-doomhammer

But that doesn’t really do anything to change that classic is still very popular compared to retail

Except that Classic isn’t more popular than Retail.

I didn’t say it was more popular.

I said it was still very popular, and there is also some overlap.

I’d be really interested to know, given that it is a shared sub, how many playeres play just classic, how many play just retail and how many play both.

[Delimicus-heartseeker]

I don’t know a single player that doesn’t use addons in Classic.