I’ve really enjoyed Dragonflight but then I ask myself if class design is as fun as legion? The answer for me, is a big no.
I think a lot of us when we said “no more borrowed powers” we didnt really want those old powers baked in. We just didnt want more power systems going forward and to start over with new talent trees, new progress, etc.
I think the biggest issue with Dragonflight isn’t the complexity to the crafting systems, it is over complicated class design that requires wayyy too many buttons to reach max output for some healers and dps classes. Not all, but some.
We need to get back to a simpler approach. When I ask healers about what they think of holy pally’s they often say, “don’t you miss BFA holy pally?” Kind of an odd thing but Holy pally rotation during BFA was just the right amount of inputs, so players could focus on mechanics and content. No mages like using shifting power, so why even have it on the tree? Why couldn’t fire mage output be strong enough to compete without this nature ability?
We need to trim some of this, but not all. Get back to a fun rotation for many classes. Thats my 2 cents.
Otherwise Dragonflight is a lot of fun, minus the fact that some professions have 10x more AH value than others 
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I agree classes are over complicated. The current version of trees saw to that. Unfortunately the groups who disagree tend to be louder and angrier.
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I wouldn’t say complicated but definitely bloated. Too many buttons that do only slightly different things than the next.
I’d rather have 10 powerful buttons that have multiple uses, so you have to know when to use which; than have 20+ buttons each with a unique niche. The first one makes you think on the fly, the second is just muscle memory (and arthritis / carpal tunnel inducing).
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FFXIV has “simple” class design and I honestly hate playing most of the classes minus Ninja and Sage. (Tanking is fun too.)
I’d say some are more “complicated” than others, but I am on team “these trees feel better when leveling” and have more fun to play around with by class. I also disliked most classes in BFA/Shadowlands so I do not want to return to those. Though I think Cata- WOD was the golden age of class design. (Minus like Legion Balance)
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I dont think there is anything wrong with niche buttons. I actually think theyre fun.
What i dislike is when theyre good enough to be included as part of a regular rotation.
At that point youre just making gameplay a mess.
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so you cant handle having a few extra abilities and interactions to make a class play and feel more interesting.
You rather prefer a class designed to press 2 abilities, throw in 1 or 2 cds and have more of its power coming from gear acquisition aka borrowed power, which you apparantly despise.
all the SL abilities should have simply stayed in SL. I realize some people got really cool stuff. but i personally only liked one of the SL talents, and now i dont even have access to it unless i play a spec i hate.
As for class design. Some specs are indeed, bloated. Or they have far too short a time to apply all these stupid modifiers to create a damage window. in PvP, one stun or disorient will ruin it and then you hit like a wet noodle.
In PvE it is just uncalled for. There is almost no room for error, one small mistake (fat finger the wrong ability) and everything falls apart. why? who thought this was fun?
No class should require 14 to 18 buttons just for damage, that is bloat. (that isnt even counting all the utility abilities) Yes, i am referring to Outlaw. and i am indeed salty about it. they turned a very fun, chill spec into a KPM tryhard nightmare.
As for the spec i currently play, Sub, Its not really bloated in terms of KPM, i think it only has one too many buttons, please remove SnD from Sub. But the modifier stacking to get to ‘real damage’ every 45 seconds is super lame.
there is no, Build a spec you enjoy, it’s play a meta spec or be left far behind.
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why take everything to the extreme? No one has asked for 3 button classes.
If you have to use the entire keyboard + additional mouse buttons for a class to function, then the class has too many buttons.
Somehow, LoL and HotS, and other MOBAs, can do more with 4 buttons than WoW can do with 25.
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sometimes yes but mainly just bloated.
complicated for example in the sense why do am i canceled out of moonkin form when healing? i am a caster after all, i am still a druid by nature so why does it cancel out my moonkin form makes no sense. also makes no sense to me why Moonkin form can’t be more customizable when ever other aspect of the druid forms have customization options now and why it can’t just be automatically applied since it makes no sense why i must toggle it on when it literally give me DPS buff and i think Defence. same with shadow form.
stuff like this is overly complicated for little to no reason.
except people telling you they use their whole keyboard for their rotation are clearly the ones exaggerating.
sure you may use up to 20 keybinds but 75% of those keybinds are utility
If theyre needed for the class to function, then theyre not a niche button.
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even if that was universally true for all specs (it isn’t), that still doesn’t change the problem. Instead of having 15 unique utility buttons, we should have 5 utility buttons that can do multiple things but the player has to choose carefully how to use it.
For example, Qhira in HotS has a button that makes her latch on to an enemy and spin around them while invulnerable. If she does a full 360* spin, she would pull toward the enemy and stun them. That single ability can be used for the invulnerability frames to avoid dmg, for mobility to engage or escape, to go over terrain, for CC, or to set up follow-up dmg. One button, multiple uses.
WoW doesn’t have anything like that. Instead, it just gives you 6 different buttons to each do the slight variation of the same ability. That is what leads to the bloat.
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The world design has more, the npcs we fight have more, so we have more.
you cant make that comparison because those are totally different games. Most arpgs and mobas have limited buttons.
Only real comparison you can really make is ESO’s weapon/swap limited slots vs wows abilities, even then rotationally its not that different, you have maybe 3 or 4 main rotational abilities and then 3 or 4 buffs/major cds.
Anytime I hear bloat its coming from someone new and unfamiliar to a spec they play, and i rarely hear the same complaint from anyone who does high m+, mythic raids or high rated pvp.
No one is pressing their entire keyboard to do damage.
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Step 1 when making an opinion post: stop saying “we”. You don’t speak for anyone but yourself
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That just sounds annoying.
Id much rather have multiple single function abilities than few that do multiple things.
Isn’t it ironic that we’re getting the first true un-pruning since WoD and people are already demanding for them to bring back pruning? Like no thanks. Nobody who played pre-WoD liked the pruning.
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Nah, i like the current class designs. Wanting to prune skills that you’re not using is the design philosophy that got us to the last talent trees. SOME people use them. SOME people like niche abilities.
I oft heard people say “it’s the illusion of choice,” well, maybe. But illusion (or delusion) feels good. And also, it’s not really. If you’re playing with that right group, they’re not gonna care if you’re using the meta build. Which means you can use those gimmicky fun niche builds. I don’t want to lose those as options.
And the “button bloat” argument is so overdone lol. I main enh shaman, widely accepted to be one of the most bloated specs, and i still only use like, what, 6-7 abilities in the core?
I mean, sure, I have many more keybinds. But those are for utility and such – not stuff regularly used.
I don’t think button bloat is a thing lol. I think it’s a myth. People being hyperbolic because it bolsters their argument that we should prune class trees.
I definitely remember that. Going into legion cut down my keybinds by 1/3. I remember reading about all the complaints about losing an ability that you MAYBE press once per min
Ironic and consistent with WoW players lol. Literally never happy. It’s like they WANT to be unhappy, so they’ll complain about things they asked for.