Absolutely all of that is your opinion. There isn’t anything about this that is fact based.
Damn straight. You would know that wasn’t all him. But Cashmeowside can get 2.1k BY HIMSELF with MM.
This part?
It’s reasonable to assume that many people posting here have more experience with the class and spec than the devs do. Having worked in the industry for a few years (Firefall/Red5), I know some game designers, and they are not Gods. Some don’t even play the games they design. Judging by some of the decisions Blizzard has made with hunters (some eventually rolled back), and some of the things they have said, it’s painfully obvious that whoever is working on the Hunter class (and Ion himself) has a very limited understanding of it.
This is true. There really is no legitimate reason to delete a spec from the game. Ion can’t think of one, hence he gave one of the most asinine answers available (“did a lot of ranged shots in their rotation”). Then he went even further and started justifying the change using the same wording they used to justify Spec Identity - something they admitted was a poor idea.
He should have been asked follow-up questions on his stance. I would like to see him admit the real reason he his sticking with Spec Identity for this class. I have a few guesses, but I can’t look inside his head. Regardless, I can’t think of anything that rises to the level of deleting a popular spec, and since he is not forthcoming, we can only guess why he’s doing it.
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Mate, you’re delusional…
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Yeah, that’s right. I’m the problem. I’m the bad guy. You can’t even save this class. Why should I listen to YOU?
Sooo…when they doubled down on MMs design and fantasy and it’s intent towards the idea of a sniper/sharpshooter, going into Legion, this is just my opinion?
Is that what you are saying? Because it isn’t. It’s an actual fact. Just check any changes made…
As for RSV, I have serious doubts about you knowing anything at all about that spec and it’s intended fantasy or playstyle. But it’s not just my opinion that it’s design pushed for a fantasy of a more mobile archetype which focused on enhancing ammunition and arrows.
Again, a fact. Not my opinion. RSV also focused on enhancing hunter traps in various ways. Not my opinion but another fact.
As for the first part of that quote, yes, you could say that that is my opinion. One based on what Ion said was their reasoning for the previously mentioned changes done to SV along with the actual historical design of SV as a spec.
I’m not arguing about how they wanted to add in a new playstyle to the class.
My whole point is that the reasons they gave regarding the perceived “issues” with the old SV, weren’t actual issues but just excuses given to justify deleting it.
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Errrrr… so I’m an anti MSV, bring RSV back hunter too, but… you can’t argue that MSV right now is by far the best PvP spec. 26 out of the top 30 ranked hunters in the world right now are SV. The top 7 are SV. Also, I really don’t think you get carried to 2800.
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And my whole point is that it doesn’t matter what they said, you would be here arguing regardless.
You are correct. It looks like Explosive Shot and Black Arrow came into existence for WotLK. It was more of an over time transition than I remembered. I think the MoP changes forced them to really start paying attention to spec identity though, since that is when specs essentially became individual classes. And when they reached that point and started seeing a spec called Survival and looking at the foundations of its background, having abilities like Explosive Shot and Lock n Load didn’t make much sense.
Purely speculation, but I would wager MoP was just focused on completion of the transition into the new spec and talent system itself, and WoD is when they started seeing this glaring identity crisis in RSV.
I do understand that the original Survival tree offered improvements to your melee potential as something to fall back on when targets closed distance as opposed to promoting melee as the core of your assault, but I imagine at a time when nailing down spec identity was paramount (leading into Legion with spec specific Artifacts being THE feature) they felt that emphasis on improved melee was a stronger base to build on than blowing up the forest.
My biggest issue is that they kept the use of explosives. If they had replaced the explosives with something like Snake Trap or strictly Pheromone Bomb, I think it would have been a much more fitting transition. Instead, they wound up pissing off a bunch of players and left themselves very little room to rationalize it.
I brought the conversation here since we were getting so far off topic of that thread and right on point with the purpose of this one.
As it becomes more club-like, you can’t trust the true nature of getting that high. Getting to 2800 involves inside jobs you and I wouldn’t know in confidence. I would write off that “bracket” because that club doesn’t dictate PvP. And ofc you don’t even need to get carried to 2800 for the purpose of gear and distinction.
Let’s say that MSV is by far the best PvP spec. How come I’m always hearing about nerfs for Destroes and DH’s? Do you think that SV would be getting more napalm if it was really the best? Why has this not resolved the pop drop Hunters have overall? You really ought to do a comparison of SV to Destro and Havoc and understand what the best is supposed to be. BTW, in my urban hunts, I can’t burst any one down as SV and it sure as dog poopy isn’t reliable for survivability. I would be singing a different tune if I was truly unstoppable playing the “best PvP spec”. Sorry, but in this high-burst meta I have to rely on MM to drop targets within 10-20 seconds. SV doesn’t get there. I think I told Kindwolf-ED that I utterly chose to stop gearing for SV back in 8.2, because there was a time I was keeping that spec current. So in summary: it can’t burst and it can’t survive, which means it don’t make the cut for WPvP.
But you know, it’s not going to last forever. The other melee are going to complain even louder to do something about SV because they would never want to play a class that was meant to be ranged from the get-go, on top of most Hunters already being peed on principle. Whether your preference is melee or ranged, you don’t play a ranged class to play melee. We already have half of what is melee discontinued in meta.
And as this is MeleeCraft, we have ENOUGH melee to make playable. We never needed a third new melee spec from Legion. Does anyone care about the melee class/specs nobody touches at all? You think SV is barely played, but I see Subs, Hances, Ferals, Armses, FDKs, and Outlaws just as seldom if not less frequently.
What…? Dude you’re a crack pot.
Survival is the best hunter PvP spec. Why are you purposely being an ignoramus? “Duhhhh if hnutre so good y r DH destro exist???”
So you don’t PvP, got it.
All top comps are wizard cleaves or full on hogwarts. You’re literally just insane.
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He’s a dual boxing trash heap who relies on bursting you in the opener with TWO mm hunters. Falls apart if he doesn’t win immediately. I also beat the brakes off him at like 1700 because I recognized double MM from his shameless self promotion on the area forums a few months back. If you’re him on a shameless self promotion alt, what’s up dude. You’re trash.
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I had answers ready for you, but I caught myself right when I saw you’re a Moon Guarder. It was the last thing I picked up and I had to retract what I wrote. I’m not going to talk to RP server folk about PvP mainly because I’m Normal. We’re not going to speak the same language, and that’s okay. You’re calling me crazy and say I don’t PvP, but I’m embarrassed that you didn’t know better than to talk to a Normie. We’re not going to get along, so I’m not going to try.
I can discuss Cashmeowside: I never said that comp was viable. Any fool knows cheese by smell. I was just highlighting the raw potential of MM. MM’s total damage is limited to a fault, which if it was balanced appropriately, it would got a lot farther. But you got to respect the dude for his discovery. I’m not comfortable with multiboxing as it would take too much work.
I’m not him, but when I saw his world’s fastest one-shots, I found a kindred spirit.
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Sure thing, helmet. You typed an essay at me after.
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Coming from an RP person? Essays, really? We talk a whole lot less than you folks do. But it doesn’t matter if I say a little or a lot if you’re not going to listen and understand.
I will get back to the subject at hand, and I will say that whatever the RP folk is doing to promote MSV, that too isn’t working. It’s obviously not working if the Normies don’t want it. So you can blather on all you want, but the ENTIRE COMMUNITY is not buying it. First off, Hunter mains are already livid and furious that their class has been destroyed. That alone is going to drive people away. Second off, nobody else is giving up their class/specs to play SV. You’re not making that happen. I don’t care who you are and what your prestige is; you’re not saving this class. Real talk. You’re only digging a bigger hole that I’m caring that much less to help you out of.
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This notion that people on RP realms don’t know how to pvp is laughable at best.
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That’s not it. I had made a determination not to have a discussion about PvP with RP people. The best PvP could very well be in the RP crowd, but guess what? Eonar-Velen is NORMAL. So I’m not exposed to that at all.
That’s not the reason I don’t want to have a discussion. It’s a translation error. I’m not fluent and I don’t care to be fluent. I have no desire to cross over to RP.
There is no difference between pvp on a “normal” realm or pvp on an “rp” realm.
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If there’s no difference, then how come I’m being ridiculed? This is not the first time this has happened. I tend to get this from plenty enough RP folk, to the point where I can’t even remember the last time I got it this bad from another Normie.
Also, you’re from WRA so technically we shouldn’t be having this discussion either. I would never see YOUR SIDE of it unless I want to pay out of pocket a round-trip server xfer. PvP is different in the way it’s organized. How RPs organize themselves is their rightful affair. How I organize mine is my OWN affair(that’s right, because I’m solo).
You’re being ridiculed for what? Thinking there is a difference between pvp on rp and normal realms? That should be self evident. Blizzard doesn’t have a set of pvp rules and balancing that are different for the two. They are the same. There no rules or balancing difference between RP realms and normal realms.
As for the rest of it. It would be because you’re wrong. You seem to the only person who thinks that survival is not the best pvp spec for hunters currently. You claimed someone made it to 2800+ by being carried? Sorry but no. You don’t make it into the upper echelons of arena by having dead weight on your team. I don’t even do arena and even I know that.
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