I am honestly fine with it either way. Been making some progress in both 10’s and 25’s in various groups while chugging along normals in most my guild runs and having fun on both the heroics and normals. I guess I am an oddity on this one or just lucky to be able to raid in both kinds of groups.
With that said I do like it being optional and would see no problem have a achievement and/or cosmetic attached to doing it unbuffed.
i don’t know why people have such a problem with it being extra loot if its not about the loot though
You had your chance to get 12/12 heroic with no buffs. Your time has run out. Sorry, but the game moves on.
i killed heroic lich king on week 1, its not about me, there’s like 2000 guilds (roughly 20% of the raiding population) that are progging hlk right now, 4% of people with a kill pretty obviously means there hasn’t been enough time, i know that you really really want those epics but some people actually want to play the game
I think this would be fair
let it be pure cosmetic items. I think people should be rewarded for thinking they are super good. I get it.
Give maybe a currency or something for completing bosses without the buff, and as the buff gets stronger turning it off would reward more cosmetic currencies per boss for buying cool stuff. Or maybe higher tier cosmetic are released.
Something like that.
Don’t worry about what other guilds are doing. It’s an optional buff. If guilds want to continue progressing with the buff turned off, they can. If they decide to keep the buff, that’s their decision. I don’t care either way.
“dont worry about what 1/5th of the community is doing, listen to me and the other two guys who are chronically low performing players who inhabit every forum thread on the topic”
no thanks
Your personal attacks don’t invalidate my points. The buff can be turned off. Your complains would only be valid if that was not the case.
my personal attacks are correct though, u have a skin in the game, in wow u could barely get 25 people to agree that the grass is green and the sky is blue, you are telling individual players to turn off a buff that fundamentally changes the experience of 25 other people
Blizz said you can just turn it off.
By the way…you can just turn it off.
99.99% of the wow population doesn’t even participate in the forums and will enjoy the buff. Your opinion is garbage and nobody cares what you think. 
99.99% of people will enjoy the buff
source: trust me bro, i made it up
I’d say if you don’t want the buff, then go play the Iron man challenge on hard core. Now that’s a challenge cause everyone case buffs on you when their not suppose to.
Sorry but turning the buff off is not an option. its a meme.
You can not make 24 others want to suffer through progressions instead of taking the easy route.
An incentive would be to remove 1 item per boss with the buff instead of adding 1 without the buff. But you wont get anything but soon another target dummy raid.
Or, hear me out, it can come with no extra bells and whistles just like it did in original and you can get over it.
Never said I cared about either of it. Just people who say ‘just turn it off’ probably dont play this game as there are 24 other people that likely dont want to handicap themselves.
Sounds like a personal problem. Go put together a no buff ICC raid if it matters that much to you.
Is this something with the people on these forums? Never have I said it matters nor do I care about it.
Touch some grass or stop interpreting things into people.
“it doesn’t invalidate my point!”
point gets invalidated
“sounds like its a you problem”
just admit you want the epics and stop cosplaying as someone arguing in good faith please
What I want doesn’t matter, because it has zero impact on YOUR raid.