Imagine PvP Class Balance Without Arena

Let me start by saying: I don’t hate arena. I think it’s a fine game mode for people that enjoy it. This is just a hypothetical thread.

How would class balance have evolved if Arena hadn’t been introduced. With balance changes based on mostly on player sentiment in Battleground or in world pvp? I wish I could play that version of WoW for a while.

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Were it not for Arena, we’d probably have seen a continuation of the ‘hard counters’ model from the original Level 60. (i.e. Warrior dumpsters Rogue dumpsters Mage dumpsters Warrior.)

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Rock Paper scissors wasn’t that bad. Instead now we have DKs/melee that are just absurdly overpowered in battlegrounds, but it’s fine because some other classes do okay in arena too. Thanks to arena, every single melee class has a 30 second cooldown ability to “become completely immune to casters.” Arena isn’t popular in classic. Perhaps when #changes comes, Blizzard should balance around what IS popular, which is battlegrounds.

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I’m not a huge battleground fan, but BGs do seem to be very popular in Classic. Perhaps if they added in RBGs (which I think is coming next expac anyway), that would make a difference.

This will probably be a controversial take, but: I don’t think Classic is the place for rated PvP. Blizzard has access to a ton of statistics about BGs and I don’t think RBGs are really required to make balance #changes.

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You’re probably right, but at the same time have balance changes made since Vanilla made things better?

Balance changes shift the meta. Sometimes just being different is better. I have been doing a lot of BGs and seeing some different overpowered classes would definitely be nice.

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Fair. I suppose this is a bit of an argument against having static class balance for an entire expansion, as we do with the Classic series so far.

IMO it would just be nice if Blizz didn’t treat Arena as if it’s literally the only PvP content in the game…

Personally, I really dislike arenas, but prefer PvP to PvE, which means I’m stuck playing BGs that weren’t designed for the characters that are playing them.

Don’t even get me started on how stupid it is that you can only get the good PvP gear from arenas…

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Imagine pve class balance without raiding

I don’t arena either, but i’d argue that Arena gear should be better. Why? Because it requires a higher skill ceiling to play well. If there was RBG, I’d say RBG should also reward better gear. But regular BG? Heck no. I’d say 80% of horde are completely brain dead or they’re just out to mindlessly zug. There should be little reward in that.

theyve literally said (admitted?) that when they design new abilities/pve stuff, they don’t think about how it will affect pvp. so not sure why you think things are the way they are because pvp exists. they literally tweak pvp modifiers and stuff so pve changes don’t affect pvp damage.

I’m not a supporter of the nerf bat in any of these classic games but why are warriors given a unlimited bag of interrupts?
Just got out of a arena where a warrior charged me 3x in less then 30 seconds. Add in all the interrupts and you literally cant cast while a warrior is on you.
There is no reason one specific class has repeatedly been given free reign in this game.

This is just stupid and the very reason everybody plays some variation of Pally/ war/ DK
Cookie cutter
Cookie cutter
Warriors are so out of control that I’m willing to give the elemental shaman who can hit you for 10k a free pass.
That’s how bad the warriors are.

How about faction balance?
Oh yeah, that didn’t start becoming a reality until MOP

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Don’t forget u can cast if u want half spell dmg/healing lol

Agreed, when they introduced Arena, PvP went downhill, classes started being balanced around prefect comps and not based on the class!

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Frost Mage complaining about Warriors? You are their Hard Counter

At least you’re the most powerful pvp caster so you’re safe either way.

Buff warlocks in small scale pvp. I get absolutely clobbered by melee and every one of them except paladins have an anti fear ability

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Yeah warriors make me cry. Spell reflect is always up it seems and they just ignore fear and bladestorm me to death. Lol

Im only 1358 in 2s arena so maybe its a git gud situation but it feels bad when half the ladder is warriors or dks maybe i should reroll lol

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typical azuresong player lmao