TBH I’d like a 100% rework of every talent, change everything because they are all so underwhelming. You could take all talents out except Obliteration and I wouldn’t notice lmfao
2 Likes
Would do it this expansion, but make glacial advance baseline.
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Make breath baseline with nerfs or get rid of it, frost is funneled into specific talents to compete no flexibility because of it.
2 Likes
I think the bigger question is what would you do to the DK. How about bring the Death Knight back into Death Knight. Im not a frost knight, im not a Shadow Knight, or a Blood Knight, I want to be a Death Knight.
Boring mastery reworks that can open the specs up to have more abilities to feel like a Death Knight that has a focus on a spec, but doesnt forget the rest of the Death Knight teachings.
2 Likes
Breathe being baseline would probably be for the best. It’s been the dominant option there since WoD and even with non pvp nerfs still is the dominant option there. Just make it baseline, make it work exactly like bonestorm concerning how your resources are used for it and put something else there as a replacement. This may be at the detriment of Obliteration and icecap can go as well if they don’t intend to throw in icy citadel azerite trait with it.
I’d like to honestly see horn of winter baseline for all specs. Defile be buffed to be valuable as an alternative option to unholy pact AND NOT MEANING NERF UNHOLY PACT. Just some things I’d like to see with changes would go a long way… and removing the gcd on some of unholy cds.
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Removing things off the GCD for unholy would be a god send, or at least combing spells into one ability. The amount of clunk UH has is insufferable.
Frost lacks an aoe spender, baseline breath with nerfs provides frost what it is sorely lacking. They might actually be able to come up with balanced/diversified builds if they did this. Too many talents need redesigns for frost, and I think making breath baseline would hurt the obliteration talent, but I think it’s time that entire talent tier sees a major rework.
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Agreed. As for new stuff… it’s time for some changes and with bos being out of the way in order for real useful choices to be made in the talent trees anything would be welcome, tbh.
breath should not be baseline no no no thank you
i want to feel tanky again
as for aoe hungering cold, defile,
horn of winter baseline and does the str or attack power again
6 Likes
BoS shouldnt be baseline. We already have a passive AoE in Remorseless Winter. It would make more sense putting the damage into RW if you were removing BoS as a talent rather than making a second passive aoe like bonestorm.
personally I hate the look and functionality of BoS…Spewing frost doesn’t feel as thematic as remorseless winter.
7 Likes
I would increase the damage of Frostscythe. I’d also have completely new talents against the Gathering Storm talent. Hypothermic Presense and Glacial Advance are not viable alternatives. I’d also increase the damage of Remorseless Winter. It’s damage is done over 8 seconds, not instantly. Yeah, gathering storm increases it, but that makes it a must have talent and rules out the other talents completely just to keep up damage with other dps classes. I can do the same amount of damage with one Obliterate strike. Finally, as everyone knows, Ice Cap is the worst, just create a different talent or change it to where it cuts the pillar of frost cooldown to 30 seconds.
At no point in WOD was breath viable for Frost DK. It was good for Blood and Unholy but oddly enough it was not a pick over defile or the dot one.
Fun little stroll down memory lane.
If you look at every raid tier since BOS was an option. (Mythic Raiding)
HM: Defile
BRF: Defile except for the one boss
HFC: Defile
EN: obliteration
ToV: obliteration
Nighthold: BOS
TOS: Go Unholy
Argus: Obliteration
Uldir: BOS
BoD: BOS
COTS: BOS
EP: BOS
Nyalotha: Icecap/BOS
CN: BOS
SD: BOS
New Raid: Too early to tell but obliteration looking very strong with tier set.
BOS’s dominance only really started in BFA and even then the longest final tier the meme icecap build took over. Every final tier so far has a non BOS option that is the best which is interesting.
2 Likes
Thanks for the reminder 
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BoS isn’t a passive aoe though, and while I don’t particularly like the skill, it does require some skill to get the most out of it and it does bring some flavor in M+.
The fact that BoS is the best option in ST, light cleave and AoE shows something needs to be done; I think BoS existing as a talent directly harms balance and adjustments of every other talent and is the main reason Blizz is reluctant to make any changes.
RW as a skill and thematically is cool, but way too much damage is loaded into it through talents and borrowed power. The fact that it’s entirely passive damage is REALLY boring and dull, I think players would rather have some sort of active interaction with talents and RW.
While I could personally care less if BoS gets removed, I’m sure lots of people would be angry, which is my main reasoning to make it a baseline skill; i think it’s beneficial for the skill floor of FDK.
breath baseline would make frost even more miscible than it is now
breath and wrath walk need to take a hike
6 Likes
It would be better than baseline GA imo. The area or effective cone for GA is rather limited, if they widened it it would be more effective. Baseline breath just seems like more interactive/skillful gameplay rather than slamming a baseline GA to dump RP in aoe situations.
The positional requirements of current M+ dungeons for a skill like GA are not very friendly for melee; when kiting and add spread becomes involved GA damage is going to drop off quickly.
First and foremost, Legendary Items should become a new row of talents. Sick of losing power after every xpac.
BoS baseline would be horrible. Full stop.
FDK:
-Baseline Glacial Advance replace with chillstreak.
-Remove hypothermic pres and replace with Frost Whelps
-Frostscythe Rework: I would have Frostsythe replace obliterate completely when chosen. I need to think this through more because that would be very difficult to balance. All obliterate interactions would stay intact? Would give us a Machine gun build option.
-Buff Icy Talons : stacks 4 times and buff raid by 3% or something.
UHDK:
-Unholy Pact baseline: Replace with Cankerous wounds. UHDK should have the option to make the spec feel like its actually wielding a 2h weapon.
-Summon Gargoyle: reduce CD to 2min.
DK Class:
-Wraith Walk baseline: Replace with new talent: Walkers Husk - Reduces damage 100% in pvp and 50% in pve when used. Fits damage mitigation theme better.
-DKs need better physical damage mitigation. Buff IBF, Death Pact or lichborne.
-Buff Death’s Reach : Increases range and provides 2 charges.
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Frost DK:
- A stacking snare on targets damaged by Remorseless Winter (lets call it Chilled to the Bone). Looking over at frost mage with all their slows and roots and what do we get, chains of freaking ice on one target lol?
- A baseline aoe rp spender: Deal X damage per stack to all enemies effected by Chilled to the Bone (similar to malefic rapture for warlocks).
DK in general
- Licheborne turns you into an actual badass Lich, similar to Meta. If anyone has ever played the necromancer tank spec in ESO, this is their ultimate, and it’s ah-may-zing.
- Baseline wraithwalk. Talent grants a second charge, like paladins horsie.
- Horn of Winter
- Presences (even if they end up not being swappable)
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I know BoS isn’t currently a passive ability, but the suggestion in the above post was to remove the talent to make it baseline but just make of a flat rp dump like bonestorm which would be passive.
I’m happy to just say goodbye to BoS all together. I don’t mind the idea of keeping uptime on a buff through mindful rotation, but I hate the icy spew. Would prefer to see that kind of gameplay be put to keeping RW up, or PoF or something.
- Breath reworked or removed, its potential to last forever taints frost’s scaling and limits design space.
- Icecap gets back at least the mini frost whelp azerite power from bfa. Possibly reworked into a 15 yard cone.
6 Likes
So many people are talking about BoSs baseline. The only reason why its able to exist how its designed currently is because its a talent. Make it baseline and its still limits choices. Make GA baseline and its wouldnt be used because of the rp cost.
Not to mention upkeep abilities like meta that was with the lock later on and void form arent like they were. Meta was given to another class and made a CD like it originally was and Void form is no longer a keep it going for as long as you can type of ability.
BoS wouldnt be able to stay how it is if made baseline. Too big of a gap between the people who can use it properly and those that can’t which was the issue with these other abilities mentioned.