I think that this is the expansion with the most difficult story to tell. It’s there something what would you like to change? Or it should be different?
I would either remove the War of Thorns completely or make it so that the Night Elves didn’t get ignored completely after it.
Nathanos should’ve died in 8.1 and a Val’kyr should’ve resurrected him, the Night Elves should’ve gotten their lands back, the Horde should’ve been against Sylvanas actions right away and not only after Sylvanas said that they’re nothing to show that there’s still good in the Horde, Anduin shouldn’t have been a complete fool throughout the entire expansion and much more…
Those are my main concerns. Also I wouldn’t have thrown all 4 GCI cinematics at Saurfang and Sylvanas.
22 Likes
Get rid of all the Heart of Azeroth/Sylvanas master plan with Azshara nonsense. Keep it simple. Have Sargeras’ sword be the cause for N’Zoth’s prison breaking. Have it cause some master system failure and cause a chain reaction malfunction, you can even use that for G’huun’s quarantine failing as well to explain the sudden rise in power for the Blood Trolls.
The whole faction war thing can be scraped. It was just some arbitrary requirement for Sylvanas to power up the Jailer. Have her do something else if they want to go that direction, like whatever she was doing with Helya.
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BfA would have been very different in my mind. I don’t think it made sense for either faction to be willing to go to war right after the devastating war with the Legion. I think the Azerite thing is a mostly good idea for building tension between the factions. However, I think it should have been a cold war, with small proxy wars and border skirmishes, not a full blown war. I think the tension built by a cold-war environment, and the paranoia that comes with it, would have been a great way to weasel N’zoth into the story.
It’s actually a shame, because Blizz had such a good set up for something like this. Characters like Genn, Jaina and Rogers who would never trust a Horde headed by Sylvanas. They would be jumping at every little sound the Horde made. I think Sylvanas would be cunning enough to play into that, and use that to split the Alliance apart.
Think of American Football, where the Quarterback says things in the lineup, trying to get the other team to jump off the line for a penalty. Sylvanas would do this, doing mostly harmless things to try and provoke Genn or Jaina with knee-jerk responses. Then, after one of them does something, she could play to Anduin’s diplomatic nature, feigning the pursuit of a peaceful resolution. Her true goals though, would be to damage the relationship Anduin has with his allies, while also making him appear as a weak leader. I would say, add some BGs in some random places and call them “Skirmishes fought by rogue groups”.
However, I don’t think we should forget Sylvanas’ ultimate goal. It’s not to destroy the Alliance, it’s the pursuit of immortality. After Stormheim, Sylvanas is left with few options. She made a deal with Helya, and that deal was likely the corruption of Eyir in exchange for immortality, Helya being a Goddess of death is capable of this. However, that deal did not go her way, so what is she left with?
It was Nozdormu’s blessing that granted immortality to the Kaldorei, and now we get into the new name of the expansion. World of Warcraft: Sands of Time (That might be TMed by Prince of Persia, idk). The entire expansion would be prophecy of Nozdormu, and his fall to madness. In the original dungeon, we know Baine, Tyrande, Jaina and Sylvanas play vital roles in bringing of the End Times, and the rise of Murozond. Some willingly, most not, as N’zoth plays our strings like puppets.
I think you could get 3 expansions out of this. The Infinite Dragonflight, N’zoth himself, then Azshara.
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I see things like this and wonder how we got a bfa that was so bad.
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Primarily, the Siege of Lorderan and War of Thorns happen at the end of the expansion, rather than the beginning.
Sylvanas engages in shady #### all throughout the story, but the Horde-Alliance conflict mainly remains Cold War Espionage style stuff. The warhawks on the Ally side like Genn and Rogers constantly urge Anduin to make the first strike but he refuses for a long time. Saurfang remains loyal, but suspicious of his Warchief’s true motives. Derek still gets rezzed and used as a trap for Baine’s honor. Saurfang still goes and recruits Thrall to help, but covertly- maybe in stead of Saurfang himself the players actually get to go do it in-game of it just being a cinematic?
Anduin finally gives in and orders the attack on Zandalar, after which the war becomes hot and the warfronts open up. While Anduin is unconvinced that his side’s aggressive stance is fully justified, Sylvanas can smirk and rally the Horde better in the face of the Alliance’s attacks. Ally players get to be pro-active and Horde didn’t start the current conflict in an act of genocidal idiocy. Sylvanas appears to suspect that Saufang has worked against her at times and gradually tries to win his loyalty back towards her.
AFTER N’Zoth is beaten, the War of Thorns happens much like it did originally, only the Horde now has at least a slight sliver of justification. Up until Sylvanas orders Teldrassil torched. Her soldiers initially balk and Saufang countermands the order, only for her to use her dark magic to activate the Azerite cannon thingies.An outraged Saufang challenges her to a Mok’gora then and there but she beats him and almost kills him while making a speech that sounds suspiciously like Putress’, or the Lich King. Only Saurfang is close enough to her as she says it hear it; the rest of the Horde except possibly Nathanos are clueless. A defeated and unconcious Saurfang is recovered and captured by the Alliance.
Thus the Siege of Lorderan occurs. It proceeds as mostly normal until the courtyard, where the Alliance reveals that Saurfang is still alive and on their side in this fight, provoking the final Mok’gora here instead of outside Ogrimmar. Upon hearing her admit in her fury that ‘The Horde is NOTHING’ to her, the remaining Horde leaders who were still on her side abandon her. She flees into the throne room and everyone gives chase. She triggers the giant blight-bomb in an attempt to kill EVERYONE but Jaina teleports them out like canon.
The Horde and Alliance leaders realize they’ve both been used and decide to sign an armistice. The last cutscene is Sylvanas on the outskirts of Icecrown talking about how all life is a prison she will free us from by the hand of ‘the one true king’ (appearing to mean the LK but she’s still actually referring to the Jailer, who still isn’t revealed until the Shadowlands trailers).
10 Likes
no faction war at all.
both factions helptheir nations.
We explore more into their politics.
a revolt in zandalar, and a civil war by those whos still hate jaina for her part in daelin’s death
Azshara makes her move at some point the same way as n’zoth.
maybe n’zoth lives for a while, azshara dies with a confrontantion with tyrande.
azerite becomes a bigger problem with horde or alliance making weapons, then we have war, and this would be the last faction war until n’zoth is strong enough and destroy us.
maybe then we can have that shadowlands clown fiesta, hell, n’zoth may kill many.
4 Likes
Oh boy. There are so many ways to take this… A lot I’ve already mentioned. Just wholesale changing absolutely everything gives too much freedom so I’ll limit myself to still keeping big events and big raids as are with just the story around them changing.
Before the Storm
This happens much the same as it did, but with a key difference. When Callia is killed Genn goes into a worgen fury and tries to attack Sylvanas who strikes him with a necrotic arrow. Genn survives but he is put in critical condition that even the best healers Anduin has access to can’t seem to help him recover from.
Anduin gets very angry. So soon after losing Varian it looks like he may lose Genn too. He puts aside his belief that peace can exist with the Horde so long as Sylvanas remains Warchief. This is an important distinction. He still believes the Horde can be good but he’s accepted that Sylvanas cannot and must be destroyed.
War of Thorns
This is where my changes get bigger. Sylvanas uses Genn’s TWO attempts on her life to convince Saurfang that a war is coming. This coupled with Anduin’s excessive use of spies and reports of Alliance troop movements in Silithus convinced Saurfang that not only is war coming, it is already here.
The rest of the War of Thorns plays out as normal with some changes. Saurfang puts up a major fight against Malfurion in close range until the archdruid ensnares him in vines. Malfurion unambiguously kicks Sylvanas’ butt with the full range of his druidic powers until Saurfang interferes. Azerite is used to burn Teldrassil, not mundane magical fire.
Most importantly we get a war meeting directly after the events of the War of Thorns in which the Horde leaders discuss what happened.
Saurfang is silent the entire meeting. Dwelling in his own self-loathing. Lor’Themar is outraged and asks Sylvanas how she could do such a thing and draws the obvious Arthas parallels, which Sylvanas sneers at and tells him to watch his tone, denying all parallels to her former tormentor. Baine is furious. Rokhan, current acting representative because the Darkspear need a voice in the war room, voices his concerns that the Echo Isles are vulnerable and need to be reinforced. Even Gallywix is angry. Mostly at all the money in Teldrassil that Sylvanas burned. The common concern they all voice is that now the Alliance will be coming for blood and that they need to prepare.
Alliance get a similar meeting. Anduin is awe struck at what has transpired and blames himself for the War of Thorns, seeing how his aggressive actions lead to this. Tyrande is furious and partially blames Anduin too, but most of her hate is reserved for Sylvanas and the Horde. Velen tries to reassure Anduin that he cannot take this blame on himself. Alleria says something to the effect that her sister has become the very monster that once ruled her.
Then we move on.
Battle for Lordaeron
This again goes much as it did. Small change toward the beginning where we actually see the razing of Brill. Houses burned. Forsaken being rounded up and dragged to their pyres. Anduin didn’t order any of this, but nor can he really stop it once it begins. Not without calling the assault off entirely and dragging his soldiers away from the field.
When Sylvanas drops the Blight on her own soldiers there is NOT random dialogue of the soldiers blaming themselves. Saurfang and Baine look out from the battlements at the agony and suffering of both sides. They have a short talk in which Baine says this is not right, to which Saurfang agrees before jumping down to throw away his life.
Slight change: Anduin brought gas masks to the fight. However a new patch of Blight that eats through leather and breaks glass is utilized, so the death toll is still massive. Additionally when Jaina arrives she brings with her a whole team of Kirin Tor mages loyal to her manning the arcane cannons, so the feat isn’t just her alone.
The rest plays out as normal, with the exception that Saurfang is shocked that Sylvanas blew up Lordaeron. Evidently this was not part of the plan she told him about.
Zandalar
I still haven’t done Kul Tiras so I’ll be focusing on the Zandalari story from here on out.
The rescue goes as normal. We learn that the Alliance had taken Zul captive upon finding him and simply didn’t know who Talanji was, and that Anduin was indisposed due to his grief over possibly losing Genn and his business with the war.
Zandalar story plays out as-is with some tweaks. At first Talanji is certain that it is the return of Hakkar that has caused the blood troll threat. She is confused when they mention this new blood god G’huun. During our quests with Zul in Zuldazar Zul also admits that his visions have been becoming less precise. More… aggressive. And that is has grown difficult to see things for how they’re truly be and not the worst case scenario every time.
When we reach Zul’s betrayal we learn that his visions were being tampered with. We assume by this G’huun creature. In the Uldir raid, in Zul’s final moments, he realizes the truth: Hakkar had taken advantage of his shifting visions to lead him to discovering G’huun. Hakkar hoped that Zul, using the experimental blood god, would destroy Rezan to get revenge for Rezan’s role in slaying Hakkar thousands of years ago during Hakkar’s first rise to power.
Zul is overcome by despair at having been used to destroy the Zandalar that he had sought to save. With his last breath he tells us how to destroy G’huun and we use that knowledge to win. Hakkar retreats into the Shadowlands where we cannot reach him to retaliate. Also during the raid we fight the revived Dazar and destroy him, releasing Rezan’s essence.
Rastakhan is still forced to make his deal with Bwonsamdi.
War Campaign
I’d want to change this the most radically. It would chiefly be about commanding the Horde and Alliance navies and engaging in naval skirmishes out at sea over islands and resources. We secure bases on the shores of the respective islands to work as harbors for our ships to resupply and from which to launch the land invasions.
Horde still ends up obtaining Derek and raising him. Baine still returns Derek and Sylvanas kills Zelling. We get a second round of Horde leader opinions both on this and the war in general. There are already whispers of dissent, but we are also made aware that three challenges to Mak’gora have already been made by lower ranking officers and Sylvanas has won them all with some strange power she wields, so direct opposition is not possible.
Baine gets arrested and tortured. We’re sent to save him.
Siege of Zandalar
Alliance come in. Raid plays out as normal. However the entire Golden Fleet is not destroyed. Just the part of it in the bay.
Rastakhan is slain, but Bwonsamdi brings him back. Rastakhan remains king but has had a dramatic shift in perspective due to his death. He makes Talanji the admiral of the Golden Fleet and Zandalar’s direct liaison to the Horde.
Rastakhan refuses to bow to Sylvanas and insists on being equal partners. Sylvanas is a lot more salty about this than she was in the base game. It is made clear that while weakened Zandalar is still a powerful nation.
Nazjatar Stuff
Pretty much as-is with the exception that this is when Wrathion shows up and explains that N’Zoth’s barriers are breaking. The sword of Sargeras weakened the bindings that held him in place and his madness is seeping into the world. Everyone assumes this is what has been driving Sylvanas so far off the edge and begin to conspire to get to her with the Heart of Azeroth so they can free her mind from N’Zoth’s influence. We also learn that this was what was messing up Zul’s visions and made him vulnerable to Hakkar.
Also around this time Genn gets healed by the Heart of Azeroth. Anduin is very happy.
End of the War
We save Baine. Loyalists learn that Sylvanas has been fighting Mak’goras most of the day and that Orgrimmar has grown unruly under her command. Loyalists also begin to suspect Sylvanas’ head is not right and so team up with the rebels with the goal of freeing her mind from N’Zoth’s influence. Saurfang still challenges her, but this time to get close enough to use the Heart on her.
Heart doesn’t work. Sylvanas reveals that she had never been being effected by the whispers like some lesser minds. Now revealed for what she is she flies off to lead us into the Shadowlands.
N’Zoth Stuff
More or less the same with some tweaks. I’d have the corruption happen along certain coasts as well, allowing the Kul Tiran and Zandalari fleets to be used in defending the world from the horrific tentacle monsters emerging from the sea due to N’Zoth’s power.
I’d also want for N’Zoth to have had some contingency plan for if his plan had failed. Maybe he escapes by invading the minds of certain individuals so that while he no longer lives physically his mind still exists in the world and he can come back as a threat later.
So THAT was a lot of writing. Hopefully everything turned out coherent.
16 Likes
Only thing I would change is either double down on the faction war story line which was the premise of the expansion and give it a more satisfactory and conclusive end, or scrap faction war and just have it old god.
1 Like
A little addition to my idea… The announcement trailer for the Sands of Time expantion would start with a black screen… and we just hear…
“The Sands of Time have run out… Son of Durotan…”
Remembering that Thrall is an Aspect… if Nozdormu could, I imagine he would warn the other aspects of his inevitable fall. And we all know how much Blizzard loves those Warcraft 3 references.
Edit: As far as new areas are concerned… The Dragon Isles makes sense. Plus, I would ditch the whole idea of allied races and either add Dragonkin or somekind of Dragonborn as a neutral race like Pandaren, or I would add some of the Allied races as customization options for the original races.
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I think the story would had more impact if:
1.Vereesa Windrunner joins Alleria with the rest of the High elves to accept the gift of the Void.
2.if Sylvanas murdered Malfurion and burned Teldrassil. It would have more impact for Tyrande to embrace the Dark warrior .
3.Saurfang should act differently … Calling for Rebellion without betrayal and backstabbing Malfurion and moaning for Honor
4. At the Battle for Darkshore Tyrande kills Nathanos, the Valkyr ll and the rest of the remaining Horde Trupps …
5. There is no battle for Dazar’alor … Instead of this >> Battle for Ghostlands and Eversong Woods.
6. Azuremyst Isle is attacked by Sylvanas.
7. Azshara
8. In Nazjatar Tyrande , Lor’themar , Alleria and Thalyssra fight Azshara.
9. Everything else could stay unchanged , except the N’zoth … he should’v been imprisoned again. Reasons- Lore . If the OLD Gods die , Azeroth will die too.
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I feel like the genocide of the Kaldorei, and robbing them of natures blessing given to them from the Dragon Aspects, is impact enough… Not sure why it needs to be worse =/
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Teldrassyl wasn’t the tree given to the night elves by the aspects that would be nordrasyl
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I know… but Alexstraza and Ysera blessed Teldrassil during Cata…
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Did they? Wouldn’t know about that, I just know tel was a creation of the night elves to replace the world tree nordrasyl
Yeah, its one of the reasons why the Burning of Teldrassil is actually really bad from a writing standpoint. Because the entire storyarch of the Night Elves, since Vanilla, has been about purifying Teldrassil of it’s corruption.
It took years, but the Kaldorei succeeded. Impressed by Kaldorei’s ability to have Teldrassil flourish without her influence, she Blessed it as a gift to the Kaldorei people.
The burning of Teldrassil erases everything we have done since Vanilla WoW.
10 Likes
Looked it up and you are correct, not a unanimous blessing by the aspects but one that allowed it to actually mature fully un corrupted
First off keep the burning of Teldrassil a mystery. The Alliance of course blame the Horde for it and swear they saw zepelins bombarding the place. But from the Horde perspective it just lights up while they’re preparing to occupy and they think it’s a scorched earth tactic. The Battle of Lordaeron then starts from there as an Alliance reprisal. Now this would have to of course invalidate BtS and Edge of Night but have Windrunner blight the Undercity as a response to their perceived Teldrassil. No one can have it.
From there have Tyrande and Slyvanas be the main dueling heroes on the loading screen. Also highlight Forsaken and Nelf displacement more than them just crying over a campfire.
Then keep the story focused on the Blood War. With a particular lense on the Zandalari and Kul Tiran conflict. The other allied races of course get starring roles. Have invasion points flash up everywhere from The Barrens to Hillsbrad to Redridge to Loch Modan. Let us play through the story presented in mision tables.
Then through the champion of Azeroth quests let Magni realize too late the sword of Sargeras released N’Zoth. He’s been free from minute one and he’s the reason we’ve been seeing different versions of events. That’d be the 8.2 reveal. Many of the atrocities caused were ordered by his agents but not carried out by them. The Alliance and Horde have fresh wounds and this isn’t over by a long shot - but for now the true villain must be fought. Then just slide into 8.3 as is.
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That Sylvannas actually meant what she said… that Saurfang do what he was supposed to do in offing Malfurion, and that we got to play a Liberation of Darnassus and Siege of the Undercity scenarios.
And that the players actually determine for the game which faction wins.
(It would for most likely purposes mean that the expac would end in a Horde victory)
2 Likes
Thread: “What changes would you make to the BFA story?”
Everyone: List of changes that makes the story more palatable and make more sense.
Me: Describes a completely different expansion that isn’t remotely similar to the BFA story.
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