For what? The argument you’re trying to make has no ground to stand on and doesn’t make sense.
A player whose serious about raiding mythic is going to put the effort in to find a guild and keep moving up the ladder.
I could say I want to PUG CE all I want, but allowing cross realm mythic immediately won’t change that a group of 20 random players aren’t going to put in the time required to prog all the bosses in a raid or actually be available the same time every week (this is what a guild is for). Changing your roster every night/day you raid is massively detrimental to progression, which is why a pug is going to hard stall in mythic regardless of cross realm pugging.
If a pug is clearing all the mythic bosses it’s no longer a pug, it’s a carry because the leader probably stacked the raid with CE players, which also probably never happens unless a pug is literally buying a CE carry.
Not much else to say. It’s not impossible, but it is NOT probable.
What you can’t seem to grasp is the no cross realm has absolutely nothing to do with trying to prevent pugs from forming. That isn’t the intention of that restriction. No cross realm pugging is a side effect of the restriction. No one with any degree of seriousness is giving even the tiniest iota of thought to serious mythic pugs. No one is trying to “protect you from yourself”.
You’re constructing this elaborate palace of oppression built on a faulty premise. All I’m doing is trying to help usher into the reality that, even if these restrictions were removed, you aren’t going to go any further in mythic than you would with them in place. PUGs aren’t irrelevant in actual mythic progression because of restrictions; they are irrelevant because PUGs don’t have the tools to progress through mythic. The restrictions, which exist for completely other reasons are just serving you as a nice fantasy scapegoat. “If only these restrictions were gone then I could show those sweaty try-hards”.
And why something being “not probable” is enough of an excuse to limit/prohibit people from doing it?
Why are people allowed to do +15 and beyond with randoms?
Why are people allowed to pug 2k CR and beyond?
Can’t you see how contradictory you are? “They may fail, and it is likely that they will fail, so they shouldn’t do at all”.
LOL. Who needs your patronizing? Keep it to yourself. If you are the kind of people that needs someone to protect you from yourself, well that explains stuff, but that’s not the reality of most adult people.
How can you say such crap if we had the restriction for YEARS? And how can you insist on such crap if we see many people pugging mythics by the end of each tier?
You keep insting on this made up story and refuse to say what would it be besides protecting the guild cartel, or “protecting the players from themselves”. What a joke dude.
For two easy reasons. One, I’ve played with PUGs in normals and heroics and they are terrible most of the time. A few of them are good, a few more can be taught if you have the time and patience, and the rest are mostly dead weight. Ramping the difficulty up isn’t going to improve the situation.
Two, for years there have been mega servers with large enough populations to support mythic PUGs, and yet, outside of alt pugs led by mythic raiders, they haven’t happened. Despite having all of the access you want, they haven’t been able to materialize.
If we ever see “many people” pugging mythics beyond the throw away bosses at the beginning be sure to let me know.
You think anyone in game development is wasting any thought at all on what they can do to prevent people from pugging mythic and accuse me of making up a story. That’s funny. You sound like a flat earth moon hoaxer.
While I’m not in the development meetings, I’m comfortable in the speculation that the restrictions are in place to provide a stable environment for guilds by preventing raid groups from easily poaching cross server players during progression. Others have speculated that it is to help generate revenue through server transfer transactions. Whether or not one or both of those is the actual reason or if it’s something else, I am also quite comfortable asserting that no one sat down to figure out how to prevent players from pugging mythic. Even if that did matter, and it doesn’t, their poor performance would do much more to prevent it than any artificial restrictions put in place.
Hahahahahhahahahha. Just imagine being this much creative (to not use a rude word) while calling others “flath earth hoaxer”.
I did not imply that devs purposefully ely made this to gatekeepe the content. But I know for a fact that they are scared, like little girls, of pissinng off the sweaty tryharders that would have their mythic castle of cards get ruined.
It’s funny because at the same time they try to find out what is wrong with the game. Why the subs are going down. Why the toxicity. Why only the neckbeards are here.
Well. I’m making it pretty clear why. They keep appealing to the most obnoxious part of the player base.
Most people run out of things to do on the second month of the patch. Only the people that play wow for a living (or a lack of life) keeps playing after that.
The word of mouth is ruining the game. The mouthbreathers (the Public targeted by Current devs) keep accepting the choreful systems, the monopoly of content, the obnoxious environment of guilds - (just check the other dude’s guild and its raider io page - that I must say once again: it is like a full description of a job position with weekly obligations) and the sweaty man still find time to push keys to m+. How is that fun? How do you even find time to help a friend playing the game? You don’t.
Or you have no friend, no socializing (killing the core aspect of MMO) or you are deprived of doing end game content.
There are people raiding 15 hours/week to be in the Hall of Nolifer Fame. And these are the ones that dictate the ways of the once accessible endgame content.
But whatever. I know I’m not going to convince sweaty weirdos that lack of freedom and monopolies/ cartels are never the answer for anything.
But you know what would be funny? If devs were here themselves investing time onto mental gymnastics to find an excuse to not be brave enough to step in and make bold changes. And blame the always dropping number of subs on something else.
Anyways. can’t do anything about that as well. It is the unavoidable consequence of a sissy generation that was planned for years.
Echo etc all thier accomplishments are paid and bought for. If anyone did a boss 200 times with millions of gold worth of BOE then of course they would kil l it also. I cleared heroic Sire and Sylvanas before several top 500 guilds simply by pugging alone.
Just release Mythic raiding and have the set up EXACTLY like heroic. IT is exactly the same game for the most part, stop gate keeping 90% of the gaming population to cater for a handful.
You bet they would be able to, some people might not be up there, but Warcraft is NOT a hard game. It is move + press buttons to attack/heal, that is the long and short of it. Look at the mythic Jailer kills/attempts, people dying over and over to the same things until it ‘clicks’ , once your muscle memory and brain gets used to the Audio Cues of dialogue then yea they can just as much complete it as mythic raiders can.
Basically, You should be allowed to Bunny hop up the ladder on mythic bosses just in the same fashion as you do on Heroic bosses, just as you do on mythic plus dungeons, locking out the option altogether for pugging doesn’t prove most mythic guilds are any better than pugs of players .
PUGSTARS - a eu group of random people , killed Anduin HC HArd mode Week 2 PRe Nerf, where several cutting edge guilds didn’t even see the end of 2nd transition. Same group of Random people from random pugs also cleared JAILER HC Week 3, once again more than the majority of CE guilds.
These are the same benchmarks to what i clear content, and i am a random no one, not in echo or method , so it shows random joes are just as competent as content as these cliq type dudebros
the issue isn’t that it’s physically impossible, it’s that it might take the top players 150 pulls to kill a certain boss and random ‘average’ players 300 pulls and GD posters 700 pulls.
okay, hold on. they’re a community rather than a guild but they’re still a group with some level of organization. they’ve got a core that’s largely consistent from pull to pull and boss to boss. it’s not just 20 random people who showed up, met for the first time, united under one banner and killed him in half an hour, then never saw each other again.
If you are competing for RWF and early cutting edge, yes, however, if you are overgeared, it is less than 50 pulls for sure.
Stop comparing sweaty first month tryharders to the average joe.
isn’t that the whole point of this thread? you said pugs could compete with sweaty guilds “from day 1” if it weren’t for the systems designed to keep them down?
That’s a text interpretation mistake. There are sweaty RWF, HOF guilds and there are late regular guilds that aim for a late Cutting Edge and will only take down bosses due to being overgeared.
It is not rocket science.
I can only guess that you are trolling. Really.
The assumption being made here is that pugs would actually fill the group and play. But have you pugged anything ever? It can take an hour to fill a cute little 20 because some of these people are so picky, now that times four? And then everyone leaves after one wipe because they don’t want to risk the weekly lockout with a group they don’t expect to kill anything else. As someone who pugs pretty much everything, and even pugged 8/12m in Ny’alotha, I don’t think it would work without a significant change to the lockout system.
It all depends on the server, if the server has low population mythic is too difficult is not because of the boss fights but filling the slot to raid itself is seem as difficult. By opening up cross-realm would made low pop server finding players or guild to fill mythic easier than have to transfer to a high pop server. Which no one really wanted to spend money to do.