Then why don't they design actual fun dungeons people would want to run over and over?
M+ would be a lot more fun without a timer.
Imagine if you could actually progress through higher difficulty levels like a mini-raid instead of this speedrun crap?
Imagine if you could actually progress through higher difficulty levels like a mini-raid instead of this speedrun crap?
I have no issue with the dungeons from a “fun” standpoint. I feel like there are still some bugs I’d like to see worked out of certain places though. Like pulling mobs on the floor(s) below you in Tol Dagor or Freehold.
Each set of mobs should have a randomized set of affixes out of the bunch.
11/08/2018 12:27 PMPosted by TorrenEach set of mobs should have a randomized set of affixes out of the bunch.
These two are really good ideas.11/08/2018 12:24 PMPosted by ZeropointtM+ would be a lot more fun without a timer.
Imagine if you could actually progress through higher difficulty levels like a mini-raid instead of this speedrun crap?
11/08/2018 12:24 PMPosted by ZeropointtM+ would be a lot more fun without a timer.
Imagine if you could actually progress through higher difficulty levels like a mini-raid instead of this speedrun crap?
I think they should take the timer away but instead have all the affixes up and the longer it takes the group to do the dungeon the more affixes get added to the dungeon.
Timer's don't really fit into RPG's.
Bring back the MoP Challenge mode design and have the timed runs reward cosmetic gear.
Bring back the MoP Challenge mode design and have the timed runs reward cosmetic gear.
I mean seriously- run a separate system for MDI and keep your timer. Let the rest of us progress normally. It will make things less toxic by making people more tolerant of wipes, and it will improve people’s ability to learn the dungeons, and improve participation as a result. You don’t even have to touch the mechanics in place- just remove the timer and steal the progression mechanics from raiding.
Speed running has ALWAYS only really appealed to a subset of a subset of any given playerbase (pick your game- most players don’t seriously speed run) as a playstyle.
I would like to play higher difficulty dungeons, but I have no interest in the speed running aspect. In fact, it’s a big reason I don’t enjoy it.
Speed running has ALWAYS only really appealed to a subset of a subset of any given playerbase (pick your game- most players don’t seriously speed run) as a playstyle.
I would like to play higher difficulty dungeons, but I have no interest in the speed running aspect. In fact, it’s a big reason I don’t enjoy it.
I think the majority of dungeons are pretty fun. Sure, some absolutely blow with certain affixes, but most of the dungeons are good.
11/08/2018 12:21 PMPosted by MonnserratThen why don't they design actual fun dungeons people would want to run over and over?
Choose a dungeon, and explain what you'd like reworked to make it fun. Not just "remove this this and that" because that's highly subjective. Give some ideas of what you think would make X dungeon more fun in a M+ setting.
11/08/2018 12:24 PMPosted by ZeropointtM+ would be a lot more fun without a timer.
Imagine if you could actually progress through higher difficulty levels like a mini-raid instead of this speedrun crap?
The timer is the “necessary evil” part of M+. Without it there is no way to gauge whether your key should upgrade or downgrade after a run. Let me provide an example: week 1 of M+ my guild took a +12 Waycrest Manor key and got it done. It took almost 3 hours and over 200 deaths. Should we have gotten a +13 key just for getting it done? I’d argue no. Part of progressing in M+ is beating the timer to push your key.
11/08/2018 12:24 PMPosted by ZeropointtM+ would be a lot more fun without a timer.
Imagine if you could actually progress through higher difficulty levels like a mini-raid instead of this speedrun crap?
Or perhaps give options.
That the Mythic+ dungeon is completed if either objective is accomplished:
- All bosses are dead and the required killing quota is achieved in the required time.
- ALL enemies are dead.
Wiping wouldn't hurt that much that way.
I have no problem with people who want to play timed-modes.
Keep it but add the option to do it in un-timed mode.
Let the rewards reflect the difficulty.
Keep it but add the option to do it in un-timed mode.
Let the rewards reflect the difficulty.
M+ is boring and the raiderio requirements are obscene at the moment. I don't grind M+ score. Up until this week I have been doing +9-+10 once a week for my chest. Now that my friends have stopped playing, I can't get into any groups in that range so I just stopped doing them.
11/08/2018 12:48 PMPosted by ZeropointtI have no problem with people who want to play timed-modes.
Keep it but add the option to do it in un-timed mode.
Let the rewards reflect the difficulty.
That wouldn't last.
Group A runs the timed mode, completes before timer runs out, gets Tier 5 loot
Group B runs non-timed mode, completes 4 hours later and X deaths, gets Tier 2 loot.
Group B will undoubtedly complain that their greater time investment deserves Tier 5 loot.
I'm enjoying m+ a lot. And plenty of people I know enjoy it a lot, too, and prefer it over raiding. Maybe the key to enjoying it is to just not suck at it, idk.
I'm not sure how they could remove the timer and still have the dungeons be legitimately difficult without making class selection even more extreme than it is now.
People at 340 were clearing 10s not in time in the first week just by throwing enough time at it because of their being no real limit.
To make it a lot harder without a time limit the bosses would need strict enrage timers and their damage upped a lot, which then in a scaling system reaches the point of 1 shots very quickly and only becomes possible by classes with immunities.
People at 340 were clearing 10s not in time in the first week just by throwing enough time at it because of their being no real limit.
To make it a lot harder without a time limit the bosses would need strict enrage timers and their damage upped a lot, which then in a scaling system reaches the point of 1 shots very quickly and only becomes possible by classes with immunities.
M+ in BfA would be fine if they didn't burn out players with EVERY SINGLE mob pack having some sort of ridiculous OP mechanic preventing groups from doing large pulls.
They tried to artificially make dungeons harder, the result is overtuned trash that makes pugging unnecessarily challenging and chain running dungeons straight up exhausting.
They are not FUN. Dungeons should have easier trash packs woven in allowing groups to make big pulls.. that's what's FUN!
Huge, ridiculous pulls in Legion and utilizing class abilities is what made them FUN. BfA is a let down.
They tried to artificially make dungeons harder, the result is overtuned trash that makes pugging unnecessarily challenging and chain running dungeons straight up exhausting.
They are not FUN. Dungeons should have easier trash packs woven in allowing groups to make big pulls.. that's what's FUN!
Huge, ridiculous pulls in Legion and utilizing class abilities is what made them FUN. BfA is a let down.
11/08/2018 12:48 PMPosted by ZeropointtI have no problem with people who want to play timed-modes.
Keep it but add the option to do it in un-timed mode.
Let the rewards reflect the difficulty.
You could alternatively start a group and specify that you're not going for the time. You still complete it and still get the rewards for completion. Only thing you won't do is level your key.
11/08/2018 12:44 PMPosted by Boskins11/08/2018 12:24 PMPosted by ZeropointtM+ would be a lot more fun without a timer.
Imagine if you could actually progress through higher difficulty levels like a mini-raid instead of this speedrun crap?
The timer is the “necessary evil” part of M+. Without it there is no way to gauge whether your key should upgrade or downgrade after a run. Let me provide an example: week 1 of M+ my guild took a +12 Waycrest Manor key and got it done. It took almost 3 hours and over 200 deaths. Should we have gotten a +13 key just for getting it done? I’d argue no. Part of progressing in M+ is beating the timer to push your key.
you could always measure it by deaths...
depending on the rank you only get so many "lives" so to speak