I was wrong. NO RDF makes the game significantly worse for leveling

[Ziryus-pagle]

@Hydroxpally-sargeras

You could have just listened to the people that told you this exact thing would happen. It’s only going to get worse as the expac goes on. A few months from now now it will be hard to even find wrath normal dungeons. It literally happened in vanilla and tbc why did you think it wou ld be any different?

Because this time blizzard asked us nicely with super duper extra sugar on top to please be social and make sure to ask who the tank is?

Since apparently that happening was the highlight of the lead dev’s social life.

[Negald-aggramar]

It’s an exaggeration, but only slightly and because we’re in Wrath now. In Classic, it could easily take a warrior over 20 minutes to get from STV to SM.

[Ziryus-pagle]

Which is still the case for all vanilla dungeons, so anyone trying to play an alt still has an awful dungeoning experience.

[Bannergut-zuljin]

except classic had RDF. Begone troll.

[Zaalg-ashkandi]

@Ziryus-pagle

Which is still the case for all vanilla dungeons, so anyone trying to play an alt still has an awful dungeoning experience.

No worries. Luckily Blizz is kind enough to let you pay them to skip 70 levels of the game.

[Aguy-grobbulus]

@Bearhands-faerlina

@Aguy-grobbulus

Is the goal of your free time to have fun or is it to level quickly

Thats an inane point… If I’m driving to my basketball league I don’t take the longest way possible. It’s my “free time” and as such I choose to use it efficiently.

Your analogy doesn’t make sense to me. Which part of the game is “the drive” here?

[Aguy-grobbulus]

@Manfighting-westfall

You can have multiple goals

The goal should always be to have fun. Any decision you make in game should be in service of that goal.

[Aguy-grobbulus]

Classic has never had RDF

[Manfighting-westfall]

You are so right my dude, and this may shock you but different people find different things fun! You know, as I outlined in the part of my post right after the part you quoted, which you are disingenuously ignoring since it itself is a response to the comment I’m replying to right now.

[Manfighting-westfall]

@Aguy-grobbulus

The goal should always be to have fun. Any decision you make in game should be in service of that goal.

@Manfighting-westfall

I don’t find slavishly doing a precise min-max route to be worth the additional tedium it adds to an already dreadful activity, but ultimately my goal with leveling is to move past it and onto the actual fun of doing content at level cap. Leveling content is, at best, just a worse version of everything I would be doing at max level. However, it becomes better and more tolerable if I can at least make the ratio of different activities more in line with what I actually enjoy doing. Questing is awful. Raw grinding is awful. Dungeons are fun! Leveling dungeons are rarely as fun as capped dungeons but they are still far, far, far more fun than questing or grinding. However, if getting into them in the first place carries with it its own mountain of tedium to climb, it can neutralize the positive impact of running the dungeon. And if it is additionally much, much less efficient than continuing to quest, then I’m delaying what I actually want to be doing in exchange for a worse version of it now.

Caring about efficiency to any degree at all does not mean you don’t care about fun. For some people efficiency is fun. For others it’s more that an aggressive lack of efficiency is not fun. Dungeon crawlers shouldn’t have to wildly sacrifice their leveling efficiency to engage in their favorite activity, and particularly not in the very bloody expansion that created so many good memories for so many dungeon crawlers specifically because of how well it enabled the playstyle. I hated leveling all of vanilla and TBC and Wrath, up to RDF’s release, and then suddenly leveling went from making me want to gouge my eyes out to being something that I could actually enjoy for its own sake for the first time ever. Twinking out a toon and spending at least half of my play time running the dungeons I hadn’t been in for a while, which consequently meant I leveled quickly enough relative to each zone that I only ever had to do the best quests in them? Bueno. Phenomenal. Tai hao le. Que rico. Sign me the fork up. Before RDF I had never once made a toon without the specific intention of capping it somewhere (either at max or as a BG twink), until RDF, which heralded a year where I made at least four characters just to level, with no intention of necessarily doing anything more with them.

Here, I quoted the parts you seem to have missed for you.

[Aguy-grobbulus]

@Manfighting-westfall

Leveling content is, at best, just a worse version of everything I would be doing at max level

I don’t agree with your retail-minded takes.

If you can’t find fun in the first 4 days /played you spend on a character, I guess you just need to suffer through it or use your one boost.

[Manfighting-westfall]

Whoa there buddy, this conversation isn’t about my takes. Though calling it retail-minded, given I am a literal beta tester from the original game who has always hated the non-dungeon and non-PvP parts of leveling (after the first couple goes we’ll say), is a bit of a stretch.

@Aguy-grobbulus

Is the goal of your free time to have fun or is it to level quickly?

It’s about this question you posed. Leveling efficiently can be inherently fun for many. For others, like myself, the net fun in the game is at cap, and in general the less time I spend leveling the more fun I have. However, because I am not some binary robot, I do try to find what fun I can where I can. That’s where RDF comes in. RDF is actually so conducive to dungeon crawlers like me that, as I’ve outlined previously, if it exists I will literally level characters just to level them, like I did after it was originally introduced. And I don’t mean exclusively in dungeons, but out in the world and questing and grinding and exploring because I can spread those activities out into doses that don’t ruin them for me. That’s what I did in 2010, and that’s one of the fond memories that I so wished to recreate when looking forward to Wrath Classic.

[Tubbly-terenas (Tubbly)]

@Bearhands-faerlina

Lol youre lying. Full stop

Nope, feel free to roll a character on Pagle and check at prime time. And those are just what was listed, I could easily do a /who in each zone and approach people in a friendly manner to see if they want to run. I’ve had good luck engaging people that way. If they don’t, no problem, wish them a great day and move on to the next.

Maybe you should actually go take a look before you outright accuse people of lying?

@Miregrim-bloodsail-buccaneers

can you read?

I might ask the same about you. I realize there’s some big words in the new interface, but if you focus really hard I bet you’ll be able to find a group! I suppose this all hinges on you actually trying though… and I’d imagine that can be hard to find time for, what with all the forum trolling and all.

Still, I believe in you!

[Cohit-benediction]

@Bearhands-faerlina

TLDR "The end-result of removing RDF for 1-60 lvling is actually the exact OPPOSITE of what Blizzard were hoping to achieve. Instead of running instances and engaging with other players everyone is just running the same quests they have run 50 times before.

“Everyone” that’s funny…
Being level 24 I’ve achieved groups to do the following from said group finder.

Stormwind Stockades ×5 times.
Shadow Fang Keep × 2 times
Wailing Caverns × 1 time
Black Fathom Deep ×3 times

I’ve done about 3 or 4 group quests utilizing this feature too.

The feature definitely needs some love. But it’s not the cause of you not getting groups. Maybe you know. Try reaching out to start something instead of expecting things to just be handed to you.

[Shadows-grobbulus]

SM is worth it. The Scarlet armor set lasted my warrior until level 60.

[Aguy-grobbulus]

@Manfighting-westfall

Leveling efficiently can be inherently fun for many

That doesn’t discredit what I said. If those objectives overlap, then level quickly. Do it within the frame if the implementation of the game.

Is afk boosting fun to you?

[Tubbly-terenas (Tubbly)]

Hey man, careful, there’s no room for actual facts in this post. Suggesting that you can actually find groups without RDF will have you accused of lying, conspiring against the grand and noble RDF movement, or being a Blizzard White Knight.

Don’t worry, we have a support group!

[Miregrim-bloodsail-buccaneers]

@Tubbly-terenas

I’d imagine that can be hard to find time for, what with all the forum trolling and all.

It’s long been apparent you can’t read, but now we know you can’t count either. You have 2744 forum posts. I have 33.

[Negald-aggramar]

I don’t think OP was claiming that you couldn’t get groups for those dungeons, but that the travel time to them and from them made it so you’d be less inclined to run them. RDF would have eliminated that travel time.

[Manfighting-westfall]

@Aguy-grobbulus

That doesn’t discredit what I said. If those objectives overlap, then level quickly. Do it within the frame if the implementation of the game.

Is afk boosting fun to you?

Why are you so incapable of being a good faith interlocutor? Is it really that impossible not to misrepresent, brush aside, and strawman? Please point to a single reference to AFK boosting in any of my posts.