I feel people are sleeping on one of the main reasons WoW doesn't feel like it used to

[Eagons-moon-guard]

That’s not it.

I felt very immersed when I played BG3 for example

Doing the classic time walking dungeons reminded me that it’s not because I got older, it’s beucase the game just isn’t what it used to be

Dungeons before used to be challenging, huge and felt mysterious and worth exploring and seeing all their secrets .

Zul Farak for example used to have a secret boss where you only can get if you have an item that you get from a very challenging zone out in the open world

Stratholm was huge and felt like an actual big city with districts and you can almost feel the stench of the dead around it and the suffering

Leveling was an adventure on its own, having to go through different dungeons as you level each getting harder

Now the game feels it has no edge .

Every dungeon is the same : 3 bosses with a linear way to get to them, everything is nice, but he game is focused on incisiveness and characters that all have good intentions and of course all of them have to represent a different minority group from the real life so that there can be “diversity “ and of course all these groups have to be presented in a positive light not as villains but as brave freedom fighters etc

In short the game is not about exploring or immersing, it’s about sending a message to every group of real life people and cookie cutter predictable content that is linear so that everyone can do with minimal effort and time investment

It is still a fun game but it doesn’t feel mysterious or dangerous anymore , there is zero suspense outside PvP

All classes have been dumbed down so that every class can bring things other classes can bring too and as a result most classes play and feel the same

I can play any healer with very minimal change of keybinds as most spells are just reskinned version of the other class spells

It just feel like a game made for the masses and to be able to include every type of person playing instead of being about exploration, feeling of being in a dangerous world and the game being more or less all about max level instead of the journey to that level

[Myzrym-area-52]

@Efi-kelthuzad

For the sake of the bet, all rares are on the table but NOT the weekly world boss that is clearly meant to be completed by a raid. Every single other rare that I know if in the open world is not a threat.

Short of a world boss there is not a mob in this world that you won’t be able to solo. Unless he takes you to a rare that has an activation condition that you can’t meet.

[Scootcher-atiesh]

I won’t deny nostalgia and rose colored glasses are a factor but if you look at the facts:

• Vanilla WoW zones were larger. (Most OG zones actually shrunk by about 5-10% in Cata).
• More open spaces between quest hubs.
• Level requirements for a mount was higher.
• There was less instanced content which meant players were active in the open world making it more populated.
• It took much longer to level, not just due to inexperience but xp gains were much smaller which meant more players questing and out in the open world.

Retail WoW today is just a hub based, instanced live service game. There is very little need to be out in the open world so everyone sits in the city de jour and uses menus to access instanced content.

[Zogg-emerald-dream]

@Efi-kelthuzad

The mobs are not a threat. Let’s hop on right now and if you can bring me to a single one that I can’t solo first try ill give you 50,000 gold. But if I can solo it you give me 25,000 gold. Two to one odds.

Log on with a fresh Lvl 70. Go to the beach on the east side of Isle of Dorn. Find the big Gorloc rare (can’t remember his name… I was dead). Solo him. I dare you!

You can mail the gold to…

[Myzrym-area-52]

@Zogg-emerald-dream

Log on with a fresh Lvl 70

Oh go home.

[Redrum-grobbulus]

Hardcore WoW is highly slept on. I highly recommend everybody try to get at least 1 60 on hardcore. It’s a real old school MMO adventure.

[Lunkel-garona (Lunkel)]

Ok, I’m in front of disturbed earthgorger right now.

[Magnarok-amanthul (Magnarok)]

@Korrsica-moon-guard

You’re older, with age comes experience and with that experience you can explore, and conquer each expansion much more quickly and efficiently than before thanks to your knowledge of how the game works

Yes, no one has ever considered people’s age and how it relates to their experience with the game. You’re very insightful. Can I subscribe to your newsletter?

[Snowpine-ghostlands]

It doesn’t feel like it used to because it used to suck, and all things that we iterate on should improve.

[Sabetha-turalyon (Sabetha)]

As we’ve seen with Classic, this is a part of it but the game is also just very different today than it used to be as well.

Playing Vanilla, TBC, WotLK, Cata, or the various seasons today with all the stuff mentioned in the OP still all hit different from playing modern WoW.

It’s true that we wont get another experience like 2004 because too much of what WoW used to be is tied up in how the community acted, but the game is also very different than it was even 10 years ago.

[Zogg-emerald-dream]

@Squeaksmcgee-area-52

What I found weirdly funny about that fel reaver is that even as big as it was and all the noise and vibration it’d make when it got close, it could still sneak up on you.

I died so many times because of that.

I ran a DK through Hellfire during Wrath Classic. That darn thing still triggered an anxiety attack!

[Myzrym-area-52]

@Sabetha-turalyon

but the game is also very different than it was even 10 years ago

With Delves it is. I agree.

But beyond that the last decade has been fairly stagnant and similar. Unfortunately the thing separating us from Legion WoW is only a few months old.

I’ve got faith they will make it even better and more enticing as time goes on.

[Luminous-moon-guard]

This is a good point. People devour the content before the content is even released.

Granted, I’m still not happy with a lot of the last few expansions overall, because I don’t feel like Blizzard knows how to make the content people actually want. It took years to get them to acknowledge the demand for solo gear progression like Delves. They poopoo classes, races, and things that players want and offer up things that clearly should’ve been put through some player focus groups first (Dracthyr Evokers, etc)

[Zogg-emerald-dream]

@Myzrym-area-52

Oh go home.

I am home. The game is tied with 54 secs to go.

[Myzrym-area-52]

Is my running back getting any points for my fantasy teams?

That’s about the extent of my care cup on football these days.

[Korrsica-moon-guard]

You sure know how to say quite a bit while also saying nothing at all.

[Squeaksmcgee-area-52]

Yeah, it was definitely good for that. Got to the point for awhile I’d only go to HFP on my rogue so I could vanish if my anxiety got too bad.

[Lunkel-garona (Lunkel)]

@Scootcher-atiesh

There was less instanced content which meant players were active in the open world making it more populated.

Doing what?

@Scootcher-atiesh

Retail WoW today is just a hub based, instanced live service game. There is very little need to be out in the open world so everyone sits in the city de jour and uses menus to access instanced content

Hate to break it to you, but in vanilla if people weren’t grinding rank in bgs or in a raid, they were idle in the city. The tons of players in the open world myth is just that; a myth.

[Redrum-grobbulus]

I think things like Plunderstorm and Remix are the future of retail. The standard 8 dungeons and a raid, is dated and boring. The core older folks don’t have the time or same interest.

Warcraft in general needs some freshness to it. They’ll just keep milking 30 year IP fans probably, but it would be nice to get some new WC titles or in game modes like PS/Remix.

[Sabetha-turalyon (Sabetha)]

Well we did also do 3 expansions of all those borrowed power grinding systems in that time.

10 years ago exactly would put us about 2 weeks before WoD releases and all that kicked off. We wouldn’t even have M+ as a proper pillar of endgame progression yet.