I don’t want the target cap, especially in its absurd state of some specs getting capped and others not, but lets be real here, you are exaggerating.
The cap will mean no more pulling multiple packs and burning down them at once. The vast majority of trash packs do not have more than 5 mobs, and many have 3 which means it will still be more efficient to pull 2 packs at once.
But mainly I’m not sure why people keep bringing up CC. Why will you need to CC because of a 5-8 target cap? It just means you pull 1 or 2 groups at a time. Go watch any of the many +10 mythic runs from beta. No one is CC’ing or taking 2 hours to complete a dungeon. The timers are the same as always and they are completing them in time. The top teams just won’t be able to push extremely high key numbers by pulling huge amounts of trash at once.
Wouldn’t be surprised. If true it would basically be the scaling issue that ruined legacy raids for almost a year. (i dont know how to multi quote someone sorry)
I kinda agree with you, but for a different reason. Has nothing to do with AoE and everything to do with it being a lot more annoying to attack/pull things from a distance as a melee spec. So much easier on my priest!
This I’m afraid I don’t understand. Would you be able to explain what you mean?
ok for example sometimes you need to kill specific ones first then others you cant gather them all up because some wont follow you till you kill the others usually a bigger guy with some smaller ones around him.
Ohh! thanks lol i had no idea this was even a thing xD
It’s kinda crazy, the better question is, is this “degenerate” play ACTUALLY degenerate?
Should we be buffing all the bad performing AOE classes? rather than nerfing the good performing aoe class?
Actual gameplay experience convinced me that this so-called “degenerate” aoe playstyle added to the game, rather than taken away from the game. its something that should be preserved and encouraged, rather than attacked.
i seen a few people say this, what do you mean degenerate gameplay? Isn’t a game supposed to be played how you see fit so long as it’s within the rules?
Hm, I’m still not entirely sure what you mean but…in these situations, are these pulls too big that you couldn’t just use your other (capped) abilities to take them out? Just how often is an ability with no target cap needed to kill this legacy stuff?
its not that they’re too big but say there are 5 groups of mobs right? But in order to make the boss show up or become attack-able you need to kill certain mobs first but some of them are not target able till you kill others first.
Hold up. lon literally called it “degenerate gameplay?” LIke straight up insulted the player base because he didnt like the way they played? o.0
The original interview about target cap spent a lot of time talking about the risk/reward ratio of large pulls which was the primary driver.
They felt large pulls were too easy to do vs how rewarding they were.
Now of course they could have either done nothing or changed something else but instead they went more with target caps (along with differentiation “cleave” from “aoe” more).
Thinking something like…Thogar or Maidens in BRF? Those are what come to mind first as far as there being ‘packs’ that have to be killed before a boss spawns, but neither of those seem to be something where you’d need uncapped AoE to be able to wipe them out quickly. Are you thinking of something else that better fits what you’re talking about?
Okay that makes more sense, but did he really call it degenerate gameplay? I think this was a bad choice. should have either made the mobs smaller or made it more difficult by adding mechanics like buffs if you gather too many or something. Or only enable it for M+ or shadowlands where the game is designed for this.
you’re right. And i could but one of my uncapped (paladin only i dont know about others) has a very long 45 second cooldown and the other is only stationary with a 10 second cooldown. It adds up quickly.
Personally the point i been making is why have it in legacy content at all? Just doesnt make sense to slow it down for no reason you know?
I don’t recall if he used the term degenerate or not.
Making large pulls more difficult is tricky. If it’s just their melee damage they get kited. If it’s their cast damage then we get “stop forcing so many interrupts” complaints.
Oof, I didn’t realize that even your capped abilities had cooldowns as well, let alone ones that are long enough to make them more like cooldowns instead of normal abilities. In the complete absence of something that’s reliably spammable, I can start to see where the complaints are coming from! EDIT: Especially having played Shadow back in Legion, during the time where I had essentially zero AoE for legacy content and had to single target most trash packs down…
Im not very much of an expert im fairly casual so i dont do M+ very often but there must be some other way to go about doing this. I have only seen a handful of people who like the cap so i dont think many people like it.
Your right its difficult and im not expert so i dont really have a suggestion other than the ones i listed.