I’m not sure if this ties into what you’re saying or not, but wasn’t it implied that the Horde lead by Sylvanas was well on their way to victory over the Alliance? Wasn’t it also implied that Sylvanas forces were well on their way to victory over Saurfang and Anduin’s forces?
I find that very interesting.
As interesting as when the Alliance was winning on all fronts and more than implied that the Alliance was weeks away from victory over the Horde?
Lip service statements about whichever side has the upper hand is meaningless fluff only meant to make any given scene more dramatic. Blizzard can and will change the narrative to whatever side they want to sound better off or worse off for their shoehorned suspense writing at their whims.
See that would be my favorite parts of the lore, its cool that the Alliance was left with nothing but farmers, and they regained the upper hand, to ultimately being on the brink of losing the entire war, but fleshing out a story that tells us how we got to point A to point B, that’s really the most interesting parts.
Well hey, I spent a lot of time analyzing how the story content of the Darkshore Warfront would play out logically in a timeline, so I would have to say I agree with you there on principle.
I disagree. Other than after the Siege of Orgrimmar, I’ve never really gotten the impression that the Alliance and the Horde weren’t relatively equal in strength. The idea that the Alliance is much stronger than the Horde has always seemed like fanon to me, and I haven’t really seen any evidence to the contrary other than the occasional line from an Alliance character, who could easily have just been cheerleading his own faction.
In fact, Wrathion even originally intended to help the Horde defeat the Alliance in MoP, but then had to switch sides when Garrosh basically tore the Horde apart. So if HE thought the Horde could do it, then clearly it was possible.
Of course, they aren’t strong enough that they’ll ever actually SUCCEED. Nor would you mechanically want them to, because that would be the end of having two factions. But they’re plenty strong enough to keep trying, forever.
I would be interested in what you think especially considering this new found “Lets go to Hyjal” or w/e the NE are now.
How do you figure sports fan? The Horde runs a train over the Alliance every time we have a war.
I see you constantly saying the Alliance power fantasy is way stronger, and I’ll ask you how because every time we come to blows… the Horde smashes the Alliance. The only thing that’s saved us twice now is Horde rebellion, if Garrosh hadn’t lost half the Horde the Alliance would of fallen.
I think the Alliance being stronger is part of what you said, a fantasy because in ACTUALITY the Horde is the one blowing up Alliance cities, and the worst the Alliance has done in retaliation is killing Rastakhan.
Our army was spent in BFA, Sylvanas evidently had the only army capable of beating N’zoth. Anduin says if the assault on Org fails we’ll have nothing left.
Weeks away from winning the war seemed to change pretty fast once Sylvanas sunk a large portion of the Kul Tiran fleet
Nathanos + Valk’yir > Tyrande + Malfurion.
Gallywix beats Mekkatorque in the end.
You can say oh the Alliance is handicapped and I’ll just say no, the story has shown the Horde is stronger than you think it is
When people are interested in what I think are like the happiest moments for me.
From what I see, in the Alliance side of the Darkshore Warfront introductory questing Belmont is captured, and then in the Horde Warfront proper Belmont is freed. Belmont doesn’t show up in the Alliance version of the Darkshore Warfront proper at all. Nor does he show up on Darkshore when the Alliance is holding it for world quests. This implies to me that the Horde version of the Darkshore Warfront happens directly after the introductory questing - this would also explain how the Alliance had held Bashal’Aran in the introductory questing, but when the Alliance does the Darkshore Warfront proper the Horde is holding it. Additionally:
Of course, one can assume instead that Belmont is just getting himself captured over and over again off-screen and the Night Elves are able to cleanse Ivus of the blight over and over again as many times as the Horde plagues him with it. But over all that, and the Alliance players having had first go at the Darkshore Warfront in real world time before the Horde, just looks like gameplay to me.
As far as the Night Elves going to Hyjal, I find that fascinating. Does that lend more support to the Night Elves having been successful at Darkshore? What is the state of Ashenvale? Did the Night Elves have to secure Felwood to be able to station themselves at Hyjal? Or are they using the Emerald Dreamway to transport troops as we saw in the conclusion to the Cataclysm Mount Hyjal questing?
I don’t think Blizzard will answer those last two questions - or probably any of those questions. However, I wish they would address in canon the state of Darkshore and Ashenvale - obviously my preference being the Horde’s withdrawing their forces from both on their own after Sylvanas fled and the Night Elves having reclaimed their lands after the Darkshore Warfront.
Though, the most pie-in-the-sky wish I could have, seeing as they’ve restored the Vale of Eternal Blossoms, is to see Mount Hyjal revamped to a restored and pristine version and showing Night Elf establishments on their way to prospering there.
Because alliance greatest weakness is their morality.
jaina was about to destroy orgrimmar, what stopped her? morals.
we could have used all our weapons in our arsenal in this war. (hello vindicar?) but the cost of civillians would be too high.
We also didn’t press the attack during rastha funeral,ect.
The horde in the other hand seems to be willing to do anything for victory, that is how garrosh got the upper hand first, and probably happened the same with sylvanas.
remember the stormwind extraction? burning a catedral full of refugees as a distraction to escape…
and Like she making a deal with azshara to destroy the alliance fleet. releasing n’zoth.
Basically, we got the weapons, is just that we never use them at their full power. that is where all the power fantasy comes from, hell the nelfs have been extremely nerfed and still put some afight in a 8 to 1 disadvantage with just the local guards.
No, it was the opposite, the players (you know, the murder hobos) beaten mekkatorke. and he survived.
but… the reality is that whoever the plot needs will be stronger at the moment, status quo and all that.
That is what the horde does.
It breaks, then reforms as something else.
Breaks, then returns again.
They are the definition of chaos.
If you want stability and order, you play aliance.
I mean, the NE refugees are all in Stormwind, and there’s a portal to Hyjal right in Stormwind. No Dreamway required.
Do you think those refugees made it through that portal before Zul set Stormwind on fire, or are we looking forward to a sequel to Elegy?
I’m not sure what this is referencing.
There was a portal to Stormwind (many, as far as Elegy portrayed) right from Darnassus. Sylvanas still set Teldrassil on fire before everyone could make it through those portals. Zul set Stormwind on fire while all those Night Elf refugees were still in Stormwind. I’m not sure if the portal to Hyjal would have been any quicker than the portal(s) to Stormwind was.
Well considering that portals in the lore work much slower than ingame, there’s hope that the night elves actually reconquered their lands.
With Blizz’s current vendetta against night elves though, I doubt that we will ever see anything like that.
You give me all the Alliance cities smashed to ruins, a half dozen beheaded lore favorites and the surviving leaders mocked as fools
Then I will give you a dead Horde.
That would be hilarious.
Oh, right, when we were rescuing Talajani. I forgot about that. I’m pretty sure that fire didn’t require an evacuation.
I mean, there’s no rush for them. The war is over, so they can easily travel to Hyjal via portal at their leisure.
well tyrande did signed any peace treaty so in essence, the war is not over.
The nelfs at least are still in open war.
Now the question would be, if the alliance is going to help them.
I want a Faction that makes sense existing at all at this point. Chaos and reformation are fine and all, but some level of cohesiveness (especially when such instances of breaking to pieces result in so much loss for the individual races of this Faction) is necessary to justify the Faction staying together’ or not getting wiped out (beyond mere mechanics saying we should and cant).
Stability and growth are not bad things, especially for such a truly young world organization. I DO think we’re overdue for both, and both the council (and the representatives participating in it) seem to be getting built up to support them. Let the Alliance tear itself a part for a bit. The Alliance players have been jumping at the bit for some good old internal drama for ages (let em have it).