Okay, look. I’ve seen quite a few threads recently that request changes. I usually do see the thread de-railed and devolve into name-calling or toxic behavior, so this is my little guide to writing a thread for an argument.
-Be Polite. You will not get anywhere with your request by being rude or insulting to detractors or others in the thread.
-Acknowledge Criticism. This forum is very much anti-change in regards to classic and adding things that weren’t there. You must acknowledge that there will be many who are against your idea, and that they have perfectly valid reason for it. Instead of disregarding it, acknowledge it and give ideas that would alleviate worries or concerns that people have.
-Be concise. A point is only as good as it is concise; make your argument and address criticism, but don’t take twenty paragraphs to do it.
-Avoid blanket statements and fake statistics. This is something that I see happen pretty often on the forums. People either make very blanket statements or use statistics from personal anecdotal experience or otherwise not provable sources. If you are making an unpopular argument and do this, no one will take you seriously. Use hard sources and provable evidence wherever possible.
-Do not label people. In this forum, you will already be fighting an uphill battle with your argument. It is all too tempting to label detractors of your post as trolls or other nicknames; but doing so will turn an uphill battle into an impossible one, as you’ve killed any support or sympathy you might have otherwise garnered by doing so.
-Do not be surprised if your request is ignored. Blizzard themselves have already stated that they are remaining as faithful to vanilla as they can, and adding things to Classic that weren’t there before has proven to be a wildly unpopular opinion on this forum. Don’t be surprised if your thread has all of the effect of spitting into a river.
Keep in mind, I am more creating this thread so it diminishes the toxicity that pro-change request threads usually create. This is not indicative of my stance on pro-change or anti-change.
Despite that your ever present “signature” cocktail emoji is mind numbingly trite, that’s probably the biggest thing that the #catertomypreference crew neglects to do on a constant basis. Don’t get used to it, but, cheers
People who are requesting changes to Classic aren’t the toxic people on the forums. It’s the people who are using the flagging system as a form of disagreement and who label anyone who do not share their subjective take on Classic trolls who seriously undermining the integrity of the forums.
If you’re adamantly against changes to Classic, then there’s really not much for you to say in someone asking for a change thread that’s going to be productive. A single post per thread stating your belief is the most you’re going to be able to do without being open to alternatives.
Here are some tips on how to be respectful while posting in a thread you disagree with:
Take up the hypothetical - if you did want this change, how would you want it implemented in a way that would align best with your take on the game?
Try to compromise - What are ways that both parties could get the majority of what they want? What could you give up so other players can coexist with you and also find satisfaction?
Be empathetic - Why does this person want this change? How would I feel if I also wanted this to happen and was being denied?
Assume good intent - The internet is an easy place to assume bad intent. Instead, assume that the person is genuine in their beliefs and altruistic in their goals until proven otherwise. What if a person you really respected felt the way the OP felt?
Learn when to leave - If you feel an OP or people who agree with OP aren’t listening to you or will never see your point, it’s OK to leave. There is no “winning” or “losing” and as long as you’ve made a single post, people will know your stance on the issue.
I highly recommend the book Difficult Conversations on learning how to have productive talks with people you disagree with.
Why though? It has been stated many times that this is meant to preserve WoW in its original form. If classic players went into GD and asked for removal of features they dislike it would be a blood bath.
If there is a kitchen fire, a grease fire on the stove, and someone drops in to suggest throwing some gasoline on it . . . that is not a conversation I want to have. It is not an idea that deserves consideration.
Coming into the Classic Forum with change ideas brought over from the garbage fire that is retail, are not ideas that I want to consider either. They are inflammatory and intended as such.
This, VERY MUCH this. So many people on this forum consider anything beyond the second page, 100% irrelevant. But that’s simply just not true. This forum is so active that some of the best discussions get buried 20-30 threads down.
I got yer back. I’ll fill out this answer key, and folks can use it for the future prior to opening a change thread.
Any change, if implemented, should be done through an entirely different server ruleset and not impact Classic WoW in any manner. Non-classic things are not classic, and do not belong in “Classic WoW” as per Blizzard’s own article stating their guiding principle. Please argue for an additional ruleset server, not changes.
The only viable compromise is as previously stated, arguing for a different ruleset a (non-classic “Spirit of WoW” set of servers). You’d have better luck arguing for that versus against the literal stated guiding principle of Classic WoW, per Blizzard. We can co-exist by doing so on different servers.
They want Blizzard to #catertomypreference. I can empathize with their feelings, as they don’t genuinely want Classic WoW. They want a “Spirit of WoW” guided tour through Vanilla with modern conveniences. If I started opening threads about about changes to Classic WoW, I would feel embarrassed and foolish. It would be like opening threads on a Classic Cars forum and insist that we discuss and allow a 2019 car into the mix, because it has more conveniences/improvements over the classic cars. What an embarrassing thing to do!
I assume that they are being genuine, but even unintentional narcissistic requests to #catertomypreferences are still bad and selfish ideas that do not reflect the official Blizzard stated guiding principle and overall community agreement in that principle. It’s simply misguided, despite good intent.
Understand that Classic WoW folks who want Classic WoW to be classic do not want the waters muddied. Despite it being the literal stated guiding principle of Classic WoW to be classic, absence of conflict in an idea thread can imply agreement/acceptance of that idea. We can’t risk Blizzard mistakenly thinking #catertomypreference threads are popular opinion. So understand that we will stoutly defend the integrity of Classic in any thread challening to make Classic Wow, non-classic.
Boom! Now no more garbage #catertomypreference threads need to exist. All points addressed. Right? Right!
Because that’s what the forums are for, ideas and opinions. Ideas do not have to be based on the reality of the present. They can be hopes for the future or dreams of what could be. The forums are a place to have a respectful discussion that does not revolve around whether we should change what the forums are for, that is Blizzard’s decision. The behavior of some on the forums are not an excuse to shut down people’s ideas.
The forums are not the place to act out your protest against other people’s ideas, but to come with an open ear ready to listen first and foremost. We’ve already seen people abusing Forum systems as a means of protest, and they have been in the wrong in the eyes of the MVPs and Blizzard. Just because Blizzard doesn’t have the manpower to stop the mass of people on every board who do not understand the spirit or rules of the Forums, does not make what they are doing right.
Imagine if everyone (myself included) abided by these rules. These forums would be boring instead of insatiably toxic. Not sure thats what we need we still have a long wait ahead.
Just want to appreciate the sheer irony of this statement. The precise reason that you and the few other hot-button #catertomypreference crew receives such focused and intense push back is because you are generally responsible for what seems like 60-70% of the replies in those threads. You can’t demand that your detractors limit themselves to 1 reply per thread and then you yourself reply what seems like every other post in the thread. People will generally match your posting intensity.
We reply because allowing people who do not understand the purpose or spirit of the forums to drown out people they do no agree with either through abuse of the forums systems or through harassment, unconstructive feedback, or generally being obnoxious as a form of protest to any change to the game, cannot be allowed to go unchecked. The WoW community deserves so much better than to have people’s hopes for the game be constantly denied on the basis of people who do not believe the game should ever be changed.
As I have said, the only reason these people go unchecked is because Blizzard lacks the manpower to do so. That means that the community has to take responsibility, and that’s why myself and many others including the MVPs are addressing why this behavior needs to stop.
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