How to Win AV - As Alliance

Suraknar-deviate-delight · February 4, 2020, 10:31pm

If it works for you. Good.

I am trying to reduce the overwhelming Losses of the alliance. Turtling at IB can be very fun. I like to fight in BGs for hours, but most do not.

So, you can Time it so that you retain a Tactical advantage without a Turtle, except for the final Assault at the Keep.

Sideous-grobbulus · February 4, 2020, 10:34pm

Good effort OP. Alliance needs some motivational training. The defeatism is real over there.

Suraknar-deviate-delight · February 4, 2020, 10:35pm

It is where Vets come in. Help Alliance learn this plan by simply asking everyone in every single game bit by bit people will learn as they learn to complete raids as they learn to deal with different bosses. It is fundamentally not that different

Dzenisz-incendius · February 4, 2020, 10:36pm

I’m not a very good leader, I tried one game I was typing the whole time and we won after an hour

But I was tired as hell afterwards

No body is motivated enough to win the game for the sake of winning the game

Suraknar-deviate-delight · February 4, 2020, 10:41pm

Well then win it for the Rewards!

Yesterday I played 12 games, I got 12 insignia, I did 4 Turn ins with the Insignia.

Imagine if 6 of these games were wins instead 50/50. I would have 24 insignia and that would have been 8 turn ins!

Double! Not even counting Bonus honor here on top of it.

It makes no sense for alliance to not care to win, and I do not believe that. Alliance is made of people like horde. Everyone wants to be able to win form time to time for sure. No one goes in to a Raid expecting to wipe every attempt.

And not to mention the fun of it! This is why we are all here playing Classic no?

Enchasia-bloodsail-buccaneers · February 5, 2020, 12:39am

Unfortunately; my current strategy isn’t to win anymore. I try to be in the back of the main ball of dieing Alliance to leach what rep and stuff I can. Then I hope a few people don’t understand, the way of the leach, and are killing LTs for bonus honor.

Suraknar-deviate-delight · February 5, 2020, 4:01am

So what prevents you from, changing your strategy from one of losing to one of winning?

Dzenisz-incendius · February 5, 2020, 4:08am

Almost as bad as AFKs

Suraknar-deviate-delight · February 5, 2020, 7:14pm

I think it is worse and sadder than people AFKing.

Permagrin-faerlina · February 5, 2020, 7:22pm

step 1 = put forth effort

Suraknar-deviate-delight · February 6, 2020, 10:17pm

Yes, of course. Effort is implied!

Izlechitsa-grobbulus · February 6, 2020, 11:19pm

This worked for us today; 39 mins too, not 2 hours. It was fantastic!

Fenrir-dethecus · February 6, 2020, 11:24pm

How to win: just hold SPGY and farm them while a stealth team gets LTs and keep them in the game aslong as possible so their Horde premades pass them on the leaderboards, and when they become worth 0 honor /afk so another ally can come in and keep it going

time to Turtlez

Suraknar-deviate-delight · February 7, 2020, 12:39am

Awesome! Keep spreading the word! Pass it to more and lead by example!

Izlechitsa-grobbulus · February 7, 2020, 12:42am

Yep it’s been something I’ve been trying to get people to do since the first set of changes. It does call for a few active people to recall at points but it’s like the horde don’t know how to put together an offensive push if we actually defend as we go!

Suraknar-deviate-delight · February 7, 2020, 12:45am

I wish I was there in that Game, just reading your words bring images of a glorious battle!

Yes recalling is part of it at crucial points!

Izlechitsa-grobbulus · February 7, 2020, 12:47am

I took a screenshot of the leader board it was such a spirit booster! We didn’t win any but that one today but in others we had some epic battles and got most of our objectives. A different world than yesterday!

Xinrya-westfall · February 7, 2020, 1:29pm

I can tell you this doesn’t work as a group of mine attempted it and it went pretty much as expected.

Alliance went mostly SFGY with a few defending SHGY
Horde went full 40 man SHGY and overwhelmed the few defenders
Alliance attempted to hold SFGY for a few minutes but as horde kept crashing into us and with us having no reinforcements due to IWB choke now setup it was a slow losing war of attrition.
Horde capped SFGY and proceeded to just hold the choke as they always do.

Ox-heartseeker · February 7, 2020, 1:45pm

You have no idea what you’re talking about. Alliance want to win, and for a while premade rush was the winning strategy. At the very basic level though, Alliance just want a chance to win.

The problem here is that when we start talking about alliance defense from the start of the game then the game is already over. SHGY is the worst GY in the game and literally can’t be defended. Once lost to the Horde, Alliance is pushed back to SPGY near the very north of the map. At this point, the SHGY and SH bunker act as a choke point that is near impossible to overcome. Game over.

The map is fundamentally broken at this point and cannot be overcome by a pug. Alliance and Horde PUG players more than likely act the same, except that every decision that a Horde pugger might make works in their favor which allows for an all-inclusive strategy:

Take SFGY? Good idea! It will prevent Alliance from having a chance at getting south. If I fail, I’m back at our starting cave or IBGY nearby.
Take SHGY? Good idea! It will be a forward operating graveyard for a push north. If I fail, I’m back at our starting cave or IBGY nearby.
Defend IBGY? Good idea! It will prevent Alliance from having a chance at getting south, LTs, and towers. On top of that, it is the easiest GY in the game to defend.

Alliance on the other hand have a bunch of hard decisions to make that must be made in complete coordination with the rest of the team:

Take SFGY? Less risky, but will require the majority of the team to push through Horde to get there since Horde can get to Belinda before Alliance can get to alliance-side SFGY ramp. Leaves smaller team at SHGY which allows Horde capture very quickly. If we fail, we’re back up north behind the the SH bunker choke.
Take IBGY? Very risky, requires full team commitment and is difficult to pull off due to the number of 60% mounts that will get cut off on the ride. If we fail, we’re back up north behind the the SH bunker choke.
Defend SHGY? Impossible due to the GY choke. Horde can attack from 180 degrees and have good LOS to fall back to. When we fail, we’re back up north behind the the SH bunker choke.

It’s possible to see now that Horde-side allows for a more individualistic approach to AV while Alliance-side requires team coordination. The win rate ratio comes down to the difference in allowable player behavior. The difference in allowable player behavior comes down to map design.

tl;dr Don’t talk about Alliance strategy when you don’t know anything about it.

Zel-firetree · February 7, 2020, 2:14pm

This plan would be decent if not for the Dun Baldur backdoor.