Resilience was a pvp only stat first introduced in TBC and is widely considered one of the worst choices blizzard ever made. It created a barrier to entry in PVP and throughout its history has always been either overpowered or useless. Should blizzard rework pvp gear with more stam? should overall values for things like Crit on gear be reduced? How should the future TBC dev team tackle the problem on reworking the PVP gear system for TBC the second time around?
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Its also a core feature of BC. They aren’t going to remove hit rating, or any of the other stat aspects either. Changes to the fundamental aspects of the game are unlikely to happen.
Changes you can expect are bug fixes and minor tweaks. Entire systems being uprooted is unreasonable.
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Or they can do nothing and leave it the way it is.
Just because you don’t like something doesn’t mean blizz has to spend money fixing something that isn’t broken.
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That’s just like, your opinion man.
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I mean they could leave it but why? It was a failed experiment no promises have been made for TBC unlike classic what a perfect opportunity to fix core game issues . This will be a thread for discussing possible fixes to the system.
issues
1 Barrier to entry - without resilience pvp is not fun making pve players have to farm pvp gear is a stupid design
2 healers being too strong when they stack it, simply put they dont die easy enough in arena with tons of resilience
3 The stats is superficial adding more hp is pretty much the same thing but that has issues with tank gear and pvp gear overlapping like it does in classic
4 Part of what people liked about classic was raid gear was usable in PVP the TBc system makes PVE gear worhtless for pvp outside things like war glaves.
5 Gear should not be pvp and pve there should just be gear you use for everything farming 2 sets is silly
I think that they should overall all TBC gear/ talents as to reduce the overall chance to crit on most classes sets in order to mitigate the need for resilience.
PVP gear should have more stamina as well as new class set buffs that reduce pvp cool-downs as opposed to resil on the set.
So while Im aware some of you are the #nochanges crew this thread is for discussing changes thanks.
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I totally 100% agree with your post and reply. Thing I really don’t like about TBC is that pve gear is somewhat useless in pvp… it demotivates me to even raid
Yea i think this is a core issue. I did not raid in TBC because it has 0 pvp benefit for me so i just spammed arenas. Combine that witht he fact a fully geared raider gets blown out of the water in guys in pvp gear form seasons past is just silly. the root of all these problems is the PVP gear and more specifically the stat resilience. I do think we want pvp reward gear tho so how do we fix the issues?
Again, it is a core system of BC. Its like saying, “You know, no one liked the Kael’Thas’ fight, so we’re just going to remove it and replace it with a new fight entirely”.
This doesn’t mean they won’t make changes or tweaks, but they aren’t going to make SYSTEMIC changes. Maybe you don’t understand how large of a change you’re talking about. PvP in BC is balanced around resilience. If you redo resilience, you would have to redo the entire balance of pvp.
You’re advocating for a literal overhaul of the entirety of BC’s pvp. Its not realistic. If you’re just posting for fun, go ahead. Just know its completely impractical.
PvE gear is not useless, far from it. You just can’t stack it. If anything, PvE gear is broken between Blacksmithing weapons, BoE belts, legs with sockets, ridiculous trinkets, Cat’s Edge, Warglaive, ZA and Sunwell gear with 200+ ArP. Playing any healer with 2 spirit rings and the Lurker trinket is just a totally different game. Any PvPer that doesn’t do PvE in Classic TBC will be at a net disadvantage.
2 weeks of farming BGs for a full set of PvP gear is not gatekeeping.
Also, the only class that stacks resilience to 450+ are priests. Every other class will prefer lower resilience (sub 350) in favor of PvE gear to increase their output / mana regen.
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I think you’re being a little hyperbolic calling it failed. I enjoyed it a lot and I was able to walk into BT with near full resilience gear and compete on DPS, likewise, heavily PvE geared players were able to perform gimmicks in PvP that I could not.
Resilience geared players were definitely generally favored in PvP, but the MAIN argument AGAINST resil is that it’s “boring”. Critting is FUN, and reducing that alone seemed a bit arbitrary. The MoP PvP power / defense system was better, and being able to gem and enchant for either your choice of more potency or defense in PvP is more interesting than resilience. If ANYTHING, they could replace resil with that, but that might be TOO radical a change for TBC considering that it really wasn’t a “problem” but more of a suboptimal solution.
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It was a bad core component of BC and there is no reason to keep something terrible just because it was there before, this is not classic we have been promised nothing so to me it makes perfect sense to re balance the pvp system. Assuming they are capable of doing it I dont know why you would be opposed. Its nothing like taking a fight out its just fixing what was a core issue with the game. listen classic was a good testing grounds and we figured out we do want changes so its best we sort this one out now while there is still plenty of time. resilance was a terrible system and we need to find a new way to make pvp gear viable without destroying the entire system again.
@ cheeky puke i agree the main issue was how tanky it made players. I do think that system works better overall than resilience
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QFT. People are being too hyperbolic here, PvE gear is not useless and is in some cases / comps superior. This may be a lack of experience issue with TBC arena.
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You could use select god tier pve pieces to supplement a full pvp set but if you walk into arena with 0 resil your getting torched and thats a terrible design. the issue si not if warglavies are viable the issue is if i spent weeks raiding my gear shouldnt be worse than crappy bg items farmed in a few weeks i shouldn’t have to farm pvp gear just to be able to pvp. Also that doesn’t say anything about how bad resil was. The only argument i see here is nostalgia. There is a reason they eventually removed resil i think they could do much better with years of knowledge.
Rep gear gives you a base of 200 resilience. It takes about 40 hours of BGs to get full PvP gear. It’s faster / easier to get full PvP gear than it is to get your pre-raid BIS.
The idea that resilience is gatekeeping you from PvP is ridiculous. It requires so little to be viable, especially when compared to raiding.
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I agree it’s kind of a problem that PoM pyro gimmicks and things are really powerful in early season 1 but that’s kind of a price I’m willing to pay. It gets better as the season progresses and by season 2 things like that are hardly an issue.
If you’re referring to someone walking into low rated arenas LATE into a season with 0 PvP gear, it depends. If you’re sufficiently PvE geared you’re not going to have a huge issue until you get to more competitive ratings, and if you’re talking about some fresh 70 walking into arena with quest greens in the middle of season 2 or something… well yeah it’s going to be rough, but so would trying to walk straight into raids without farming dungeons and heroics first.
By the way, I have “seen” people not me 
pilot fresh quest geared toons to 1850-2K in TBC and Wrath mid season, so there is something to be said for the way that skill used to have more weight in the arena game. Cata and onwards the skill cap really started to suffer and your gear began to determine the outcome a whole lot more.
40 hours is a long time for me that is over a month of playing wow. Second you have missed the point PVP gear should not be required to pvp at all that a bad system. The overpowered nature of resilience can be seen in that you can be in higher ilvl gear yet do less damage than the other guy in worse gear it doesn’t make sense. You should be able to pvp and effectively with zero pvp gear on.
You could flip that argument on its head and say its unfair that someone that doesn’t even pvp often can walk into a bg or arena with full bis raid gear and delete people without any skill or counterplay
Imo resilience was a GREAT system and i would LOVE if blizzard brought it back in some way.
Having the best gear for pvp come from pvp content is good imo, and pve gear wasn’t “useless” it was actually quite good in many cases, you would just be a glass cannon that did way more damage but couldn’t take a beating yourself, it adds more variety
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I dont think they should be able to delete people or that the pve gear should be superior but it should be comparable. Resilance is so broken that wearing a full pvp set was mandatory which was imo no fun at all.
If 40 hours is a month for you, you’re going to have bad gear regardless of resilience.
It takes 80 hours to level 60-70.
It takes 40 hours to get your pre-raid BIS or your PvP gear.
So regardless of the system, you’re 3 months behind in both PvE and PvP and not willing to accept it.
Do you realize that the reason this exists is because PvP players who DON’T want to raid would then need to PvE to compete?? You can agree or disagree with the design philosophy of allowing players to self-segregate in this way, but this was the philosophy at the time. If you have a problem with resil as a solution that’s fine, that’s kind of why I suggested PvP power / defense as a possible replacement but it would be a lot of re-itemization for something like that.
By the way, players are demanding a PvP stat back for Shadowlands because of how much of a mess the type of gear balance you’re asking for caused in BFA.
As it stands in TBC, PvE gives you an edge in PvP in some ways, but isn’t mandatory. To most arena junkies, that’s fair.
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