My guild finally got Vashj down tonight before any “nerfs” went through. I can safely speak for all of us when I say that it doesn’t make us feel any better having killed it in this state and would’ve preferred if the mind control fix had gone in a week or two weeks earlier. For every guild on this server that’s killed it, there are several more that are struggling to keep players because people are getting sick of dealing with mechanics which seem intentionally designed just to waste their time.
The proposed nerfs to mind control weren’t even referred to as nerfs in original TBC, they were called fixes because somebody back then realized that without any counter-play you were just rolling the dice until you got lucky enough to get the kill which is exactly what happened tonight.
Stop postponing nerfs. TBCC isn’t just for some ultra-minority of players who care about pre-nerf kills or speedruns, they’ve had more than enough time to enjoy this broken content which should never have existed for this long.
I get why people think the fight is a dice roll, but what that doesn’t explain is how guilds who went 10/10 one week are also consistently going 10/10 each week after. If the fight was truly random we would expect many one-off kills that weren’t repeated every single week, but we don’t see that.
Sure, there’s the occasional unlucky wipe to a rough chain of events, like your tank getting shock blasted in between grounding totem CD’s right as a poison pool drops on him, but these events aren’t consistently causing wipes for 10/10 guilds each week, nor are these guilds simply getting lucky every single week.
Point is, take the W friend. You suffered through prog and got a kill, you should feel good about it. Next week will be even easier assuming you aren’t ignoring her for KT prog.
My guild is 9/10 and filled with dads, we raid casually 2 days a week. Nerfs are warranted this deep into the phase since it’s just not possible to do 2 full raids and prog very difficult fights within 6-7 hours a week. I know sweaty players will complain that they want their kill on Vashj to have more meaning (despite many of them using exploits) but frankly I don’t care.
TBC is already far from an authentic experience, the nerfs would be out if we used the live schedule since BT was already out by now. The fights were made to stop them being cleared prior to the release of BT and to stop people getting into Hyjal. I know you want to gatekeep your kills but it isn’t good for the game, just your ego.
Consume prices are now also getting significantly higher since even the best guilds can wipe to RNG on Kael or Vashj.
I really don’t think it’s about luck. Phase 3 is a test of player awareness and reaction time (get out of bad) and raid dps (kill her before too many mistakes are made).
It also helps if players aren’t wearing a bunch of gear with no stamina (more hp gives you and your healers more time to react). And yes, it helps if you have a full raid with good comp. It’s a 25-man raid, so you’re expected to have 25 people.
Check all the boxes above and she can be reliably 1-shot farmed.
It won’t matter when they put the nerfs in. If those guilds don’t die before then, they’ll die in Phase 3. They will be back on the forums complaining about the Hyjal trash and how they have to reclear it when they wipe on any of the bosses and their raids “don’t have enough time” to do the content.
The nerfs don’t need to happen. If you’re not good enough join a team who is. If your guild can’t down things without a nerf then the guild is going to die in later tiers.
Skip TK and just work on Vashj for as long as it takes to kill her. It’s not as much about the boss being “hard” as it is people just either not having enough exposure or just plain not being good enough (raid awareness, dps, self preservation) to kill her.
BT is not out so there’s absolutely no reason other than “we can’t kill her” to nerf the fight.
PTR for phase 3 will go live December 14th most likely thats why they are doing the nerfs to give guilds a month to down the bosses while the ptr is up.
The vocal members of the 8/10 community fought this the hardest under the misguided belief they could get blizz to do trash nerfs instead (requires actual dev time, was never going to happen).
Now they get to not get kills, have the rosters decimated more and then fall apart as people leave for guilds who can clear.
Those people are legitimately better, better prepared, have useful alts for swaps, have a bench, practice on ptr ect. It’s quite easy to explain but tht issue is, is that the standard blizzard wants to cater too?
They don’t want the 8/10 garbage to feel bad when they’re too busy getting attuned while everyone else is in mount hyjal/bt. It’s why they did difficulty modes in wrath onwards. Bad players want to feel included and throw a fit if they can’t do every boss