MM is worse by a sizeable margin. People would be playing MM if it was anywhere near close. That’s why there is a parse disparity, not because of some preference for Surv.
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why use anub? look at like jaraxxus
We were discussing Anub previously (referencing the single MM Zerg kill), so I wanted to keep the consistency
No comment.
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If you want to see something funny, you should click on that raid and see where his 100 and top Hunter DPS puts him vs the rest of his raid.
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MM for PvE gets buffed for ICC, BM gets buffed for Cata prepatch. So just wait a little. Hunts will become so good they will knock your rogue out of place and you will wish you had never sked for that. And also… Blizzard did a pretty bad job of adding in the focus for Cata at first. So I dont think Cata will come out on the first patch. Pretty sure Cata is where they get their focus. And that class was designed to eventually go OOM after casting too much. Most of their attacks are white damage at the lower levels, their dots from ticks in Cata are really good as well. In both PvE and PvP you do see many nerfs but end up seeing WAY More buffs to the class overall. They do become pretty good in Cata seeing as how a class that was dsinged to go OOM with too much casting and run out of ammo with too many attacks can now no longer go oom or run out of mana.
MM ICC BM Cata. Surv is just… there.
My brother, you know that Surv can’t trap weave on Twin Valks right?
Aw yes lets ignore the impact of the fight being 24 seconds shorter than the 2nd place person.
The overall groups dps was considerably better, resulting in the higher dps due to less time spent outside of CDs.
And that is twin valks, where SV is at its weakest because you cannot trap weave.
No comment.
Let’s take a look at the Survival Hunter who’s at number 2:
Oh, what do you know! At 1:30 into their kill he was going 700 LESS DPS. So no, you are wrong:
Again, cant use explosive trap on that fight. That alone is a huge dps loss for SV compared to MM which isnt nearly as effected.
But yes, on single target MM us close to SV. Its when aoe is added to the fight that SV really pulls agead.
I was at least hoping they would fix MM for Wotlk Classic Era if that’s a thing they plan to do, the “wait for next xpack” is just copping to me. Also MM in ICC will be middle of the pack at best (C Tier) which is kinda insulting for a late spec.
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Of the top 100 Hunter Parses on Northern Beasts there are 0 MM parses
Of the top 100 Hunter Parses on Lord Jaraxxus there are 2 MM parses (one at 7th place and the other at 90th)
Of the top 100 Hunter Parses on Faction Champions (not logged fight so these numbers are less important) there are 0 MM parses.
Of the top 100 Hunter Parses on Anub there are 2 MM parses (first at 10 and second at 36)
Overall looking at these numbers this leaves Survival as the vastly superior spec. Further more we can take a look at the Twin Valks fight and see what would happen if trap weaving were allowed! As a standard measurement trap weaving accounts for 13 to 15% of Survivals damage (on single target fights, fights like Jaraxxus it can go up past 20%). If we were to take the top Survival dps on Twin Valks 16,805.9 and apply 15% 2520.885 that would leave us with a total of 19,326.79 which would place Survival noticeably higher than MM. It should be noted that MM also trap weaves but only gains 8% of their total damage meaning if we allowed MM to trap weave we’d see their dps go up to 18,388.94 which is around a ~900 dps decrease from our Survival Maximum.
This falls inline with my previous comments that Survival will always do 700 to 1000 dps more than MM, when standard tactics apply.
And unfortunately no amount of additional parses will be able to shorten that gap to where we’d see both specs in the same tier.
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Well this is just flat around wrong. Black Arrow exists, do you know how it works?
Oh my apologizes I forgot to take into account Black Arrow. When only Black Arrow is used it will account for 2 to 3% of all damage. Taking this into consideration that would leave the real survival number at 19,074.69 which is roughly a ~700 dps increase.
Once again leaving us with a 700 to 1000 dps increase when compared to MM
Oh… so you don’t know how Black Arrow works.
I think they should just release the prepatch along with ICC frfr 
.
Ah shoot I totally forgot about the 6% damage increase
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Don’t forget about the missed auto shots from trap weaving when doing your new calculations as well.
Again, I’m not trying to argue that MM is better than SV. My entire argument has been that it’s closer than it appears on WCL for a number of reasons. Maybe it’s easier to play too? I don’t know. This is the best version of the game for people to play around with specs and try different things but almost everyone is so focused on playing the best thing out there even if the difference isn’t all that large.
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So after doing the math you are 100% correct, when accounting for the debuff, missed auto shots and BL damage MM does 121 more DPS than Survival (if both were allowed to Trap Weave). Meaning only on fights with 2 or more targets will Survival pull ahead.
you realize those top parsers, esp the chinese ones, just wipe when the kill isn’t fast enough right? they only play to cheese parses.
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