Oh my God get over yourself, suck it up. Elune being the only “True Deity” of WoW would be the biggest Alliance-centric unbearable cop-out in all of Blizzard history.
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It’s lazy writing.Can’t interfere with the Night Elf Power Myth after all. I mean god forbid if anyone outside NE fans have something they can relate to, you know?
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Elune, the only “true deity”?
Whoa-ho-ho-ho, mon! Ya be forgettin’ ya old pal, Bwonsamdi?
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Just so I’m clear, the mystery of Elune - an ubergod - would be damaged, by the potential of there being any other mysterious ubergods?
And, that’s also true even if any other potential ubergods have been portrayed as being worshipped by other cultures previously.
This seems more like a case wanting the power of Elune to be unique, not the mystery of Elune. And, coincidentally, the power of Elune seems only accessible by one race (and therefore, one faction). If Elune is a sole supreme deity then that effectively deems Night Elves the only race with a conduit to supreme power, it makes them “right” in a spiritual sense, and it’s a super power that no one can match.
It would be interesting to see Elune try to take some action on behalf of the Night Elves only to stopped by An’she (or some other ubergod, or even a whole slew of unknown ubergods).
But in reality I’d rather find out Elune/An’she/whomever else are just junior-level deities that wander around doing cosmic good deeds. I hope after Elune took Ysera, Elune turned to one of her colleagues and said, “Everybody gets one.”
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Even as a worgen player, I got a kick out of Bwon, his comments when you die in Nazmir are some of the best. I love his I see you got in over your head again. Plus he was fun to quest with in Ardenweald
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Eh the way I see it, “First Ones” sounds like “Creator Pantheon” with what has been said so far.
So they can either
- Have WoW be Cosmically Polytheist: there were a group of Creator Beings who Created Things
- Have WoW be Cosmically Monotheist: there was a Creator who made Secondary Creator Lesser Pantheon Who Created Things
I do not want or foresee WoW being Monotheist.
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Please, for the love of Illidan, NO.
This would literally be the ultimate slap of, “Yes, only white Western Humans with their Holy Light truly matter in this game.”
No, no, ten thousand years of imprisonment, NO.
This is more plausible, imo, because it allows for them to keep the spirit of the original “Titan Pantheon” intact, with multiple creators being responsible for/overseeing the various powers/races/classes/traditions, etc.
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Rezan had a mother. An absolutely monstrously huge devilsaur wild god. Who might Rezan’s father be, I wonder, and why does Rezan have the power of the Sun?
Granted, it’d kind of suck that our Cenarius is dead forever. But it just makes the comparison more apt, really.
The Horde’s demigod is dead. The Alliance’s demigod is neutral. Really encapsulates how the two factions’ heroes have been portrayed the entire franchise, really.
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and it allows for a potential family tree! Eonar and Winter Queen being sisters as they are both “daughters” of Elune, but Eonar and Kyrestia being sisters because they are both “daughers” of An’she
An’she :V haha
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Bwonsamdi did have parents though. He was a mortal troll lol
But I 100% agree on him being a ‘true deity’, especially with how much he loves his ‘race’ and worshippers, and will even go as far as hurting himself to save them from going to ‘hell’
Its really cute how he’s just sitting there reading a map (does he ever get lost?) or fishing, whenever you die in Zandalar.
There’s an addon that plays siome of his death quotes everytime you die. It’s even voice acted! I downloaded it to make dying less infuriating lol
(Gods I miss hearing his voice…)
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The Horde gift-wrapped Sira Moonwarden for Tyrande with the promise of “This is not what is owed, but it’s a start.” They hunted down Nathanos in Nazmir with the intent to capture or kill him, and would have succeeded if he hadn’t used a handy pocket teleport to escape. Lor’themar tasked the Farstriders with hunting down Sylvanas and Nathanos immediately after the war campaign finale, and said as much that it was his duty to act because maybe if he had confronted Sylvanas when he first had concerns about her, Teldrassil wouldn’t have burned. I really don’t see how you can ignore that as taking action and responsibility. As for Alliance demands, Tyrande has demanded Sylvanas’ head as a price for Thrall to ever speak to her again, and has a different set of impossible-to-meet demands for forgiveness. Shadows Rising also makes a point of showing the Horde leadership choosing to use diplomacy over aggression when conflict arises with the Alliance, saying that they must do their best to show that they signed the armistice in good faith or else it will all be for naught.
The interaction at Icecrown isn’t about Lor’themar and the others trying to get out of bringing Sylvanas to justice, or not feeling guilty over their actions, it’s about not leaving the Alliance and Horde leaderless in the middle of a zombie apocalypse when the peace between the factions as a result of the armistice is still extremely fragile. Lor’themar isn’t particularly optimistic about anyone who goes through the rift being able to make it back in one piece, and the remaining leaders are too important to risk for such a mission, so we the players, who are both incredibly lucky and also quite disposable, get sent through along with a bunch of green death knights who no one particularly cares about (and Darion Mograine, who has basically no sense of self-preservation). Lor’themar even sends us off with words basically thanking us for our service and promising to dedicate a nice park bench in our memory when we don’t make it back. Besides, if it’s a matter of guilt, the Horde player who participated in the War of Thorns did far more to aid Sylvanas’ schemes than the remaining Horde leaders did, it’s only fitting that we take the biggest risks to chase down Sylvanas in game.
Highlighting this to say 100% yes, please. I’ve wondered for awhile now what Lilian’s reaction to seeing Whitemane up and about as a death knight would be after Lilian went to such lengths to make sure she stayed dead, and I’ve also wondered about the possibility that Lilian and Darion might have been acquainted with each other when they were both still alive. By my estimation they should be relatively close in age, and I picture the remnants of the old Silver Hand as having had fairly close contact with each other before Alexandros died and the Scarlets and Argent Dawn formed.
I’m all for more development of Sin’dorei and Tauren religion. I think it’s a bit absurd that we don’t know anything about the current structure of the priesthood in Silvermoon, considering Liadrin’s own history as both a high-ranking priestess and adopted daughter of the previous High Priest.
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That’s one of Illidan’s biggest problems, his stubborn refusal to explain himself before. It also ties into that belief that people should either let him do whatever or immediately trust what he says.
To quote from his character page on TV tropes,
" * Poor Communication Kills: Illidan is really bad at getting his point across to others.
- Warcraft III: The magic he was using to try and destroy the Frozen Throne almost tore Northrend apart, so naturally his brother attempted to stop him. Granted he was only doing it because Kil’jaeden ordered him to do so and nobody at the time knew that killing the Lich King would have made the Scourge go wild, he may have at least gotten some sort of aid his methods didn’t involve blowing up a continent.
- War of the Ancients, Illidan worked as a double agent, pretending to join Legion then use the Dragon Soul to destroy the Legion’s portal. Only he told absolutely nobody this, and given his previous actions, everyone just assumed he went rogue.
-
Burning Crusade and the Illidan novel: Perhaps in an attempt to justify exactly why Illidan became a raid boss.
- It turns out that Illidan had promised the Black Temple to Akama after defeating Magtheridon and later after he finishes his work on Outland. However, he kept changing the terms of the agreement and further corrupted the Black Temple, leading Akama to believe he had no intention of honoring their agreement. Leading to his Mistreatment-Induced Betrayal. To deal with this instead of actually explaining his plans, Illidan broke his soul, creating the Shade of Akama and used it to bind him, and the Ashtongue to his cause.
- During the Expansion, the Sha’tar, Alliance, and Horde saw Illidan at work creating the Fel Horde, enslaving Broken, and draining Zangarmarsh. Before the forces of Azeroth even got to Outland, Shattrath was attacked by blood elves, supposedly at Illidan’s command. What Illidan was actually doing was preparing his forces on Outland to invade Argus and stop the Legion at it’s source. He just didn’t tell anybody, completely missed the fact that Kael’thas turned traitor, which is what got the people of Outland against him in the first place.
- Finally, when Black Temple is actively being assaulted, Illidan sends his demon hunters away on a mission and waits to fight the raiders. He also just monologues about himself and Akama instead of explaining his plan to Akama or the raiders.
- Even in Legion, this continues. His argument about having The Chosen Many rather than The Chosen One could’ve been better received if he’d explained it sooner and avoided killing Xe’ra."
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Memory is fuzzy, but I believe I wrote or edited that section lol
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That was Thrall. Thrall captured her"
The blunt end of Thrall’s axe cracked into her helmet, silencing her. Sira crumpled tot he ground, her glaives clattering to the stones, her helmet slipping off her head and rolling away. Thrall broke through the crowd of Zandalari and stopped the helm with the toe of his boot.
“Bind her tightly,” he told the trolls. “I know exactly what to do with her.”
It was Thrall that sent her to Tyrande.
“Thrall wanted her delivered to Tyrande WHisperwind and Malfurion Sotrmrage, along with the letter.”
…
Sira Moonwarden’s Crimson eyes flared fire-bright in the gloom. No such brightness came from Tyrande’s eyes, though if the blackened pits there could twingle and dance, they would. Her prize. Thrall’s gift.
This is not what was owed, he wrote. But I hope it is a start.
That is my whole point. Everything we see being done to try and make amends is all Thrall. Nothing from the other Horde leaders or any general actions by the Horde. Just Thrall, the one guy that was not even part of the WoT.
Yes. And again the problem is that Sylvanas wronged the Horde as well. We have been told multiple times they have their own reasons for wanting her dead or captured. So, hunting her can’t really be put in the category of making amends.
Now, if the Horde captures her and then turns her over to Tyrande I will give them credit for it. But right now it looks no different than them going after Garrosh for Horde justice to the point of arguing over their right to him. They made a point with him that they didn’t think they Alliance had any claim. Outside of Thrall we are seeing the Horde hunting her for their own reasons.
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So like, in real life, a representative of a State stands in persona the Nation-State.
In fact, the same book you’re quoting mentions Tyrande would meet with nobody except Thrall.
So he is, in fact, in persona the Horde by Tyrande’s request.
Which is generally how real world peace treaties and negotiations work.
Uh no, again, in the real world the capture of the former tyrant that started a war serves as amends to both the nation-state that they abused and the people who that tyrant hurt.
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They also hold a series of war criminal cases—cough Nuremberg cough—for said tyrant’s evil minions, though.
Especially in cases of genocide and other war crimes.
Which doesn’t really bode well for, say, people like Belmont, Sira, Delaryn, and the majority of the remaining Forsaken army.
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Sure we can do that, once the Human Kingdoms stand trial for the concentration camps and enslavement.
Or the Draeni for colonizing the home of the Orcs, knowingly endangering various peoples knowing full well the Legion would eventually find them.
Etc
Best to go in historical order I think.
Um, hate to break it to you, but…
The “human kingdom” that was largely responsible for the concentration camps got wiped out by its own heir.
And then turned into the Forsaken kingdom.
And then it got blighted.
Oh, you can go say hi to the vast majority of those Draenei anytime you like.
You’ll find them on the Path of Glory in Hellfire Peninsula.
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There was nothing evil about the concentration camps, and one should not put it on the same level as genocide.
The old Alliance has 3 options for what to do with the Orcs…
- Kill them all
- Let them go
- Imprison them
Only number 3 was a moral option, like putting mass murderers in prison. Now that doesn’t mean number 3 justifies some of the abuse the orcs got from some of the humans. That was wrong, but that doesn’t make the system itself immoral. Sometimes there are dirty cops, and sometimes the feds act immoral to prisoners. But that doesn’t mean bad guys should never be locked up for there crimes.
Now now, the sociopolitical entity that those people were a part of became the modern Alliance, and we have no proof of how old the Forsaken we have today are in majority! For all we know some people could be Anduin’s great great great great grandfather.
Ding dong you are wrong
concentration camps are always wrong and evil and equal in gravity to genocide.
Thanks for playing!
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